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pattonme

Ohlins NIX-22 technical review

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pattonme
Ed. I will make a few passes at this post and thread in general so don't jump to conclusions too quickly.
 
Bump vs vehicle speed vs Supension velocity
 

[th style=border:1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);padding:3px]20mph[/th][th style=border:1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);padding:3px]30mph[/th][th style=border:1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);padding:3px]50mph[/th][th style=border:1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);padding:3px]70mph[/th]
[/tbody] 
 
Compression damping with original piston.
compression%20curve%20stock.png
 
Compression damping with *flipped* piston.
compression%20curve%20flipped.png
 
Compression with flipped piston and Matt's quick and dirty valving.
Compression%20curve%20flipped%20with%20custom%20valving.png
 
Compression (stock) vs ideal (orange line)
compression%20curve%20stock%20vs%20ideal.png

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rick
So much jargon.
 
Is it correct in saying that unless the roads are all smooth as silk, none of these cartridge set-ups can flow well enough on the C side right out of the box and need help?

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sansnombre
Are these measured values or analytical?
And where is your "ideal" curve coming from? Ideal damping is pretty application/rider specific.

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pattonme
@rick , no I wouldn't say *all* are not well setup, just that the ones I've dealt with so far have benefited from massaging. Aside from the Matris which was just off the charts, on smoothish tracks where the Andreani and NIX-22 are targeted, they'll work well enough that championships are being won using them. But nobody actually says what they've done to the internals even if the outside says Ohlins or Andreani. I can't imagine race teams of that caliber don't have their own tweaks.
 
@sansnombre , the values are analytical. I don't have the gear to do instrumented testing. My 'ideal' curve is something I've put together over the years sharing experiments on early CBR fork application, multiple commercial product purchases and (not) liking some of the results, and my own experimentation and preferences testing on my personal bikes. Yes it is street biased but has worked quite well on the tracks I go to (Summit Point, VIR, Blackhawk Farms).
 
It's the curve I've used to build somewhere north of 50 sets of forks and the feedback has generally been pretty good.

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rick
Your "massage", transforming my Andreani from 2 to 3 valves, has made it far better. I suspect a lighter spring to match my weight (need to look into this), a lower fork oil level (will try this 1st), or a combo of the 2 will put mine right where I had imagined when I started this transformation.
 
So I'd say your theoretical is pretty darn good.

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pattonme
and cue @2wheeler 's thoughts on riding the NIX thru Clifton this weekend.
 
I rode his, obviously, with just a spring change and my magic thicker oil mix (JK) and while there were a number of other factors at play, my changes to his forks felt pretty damn good but felt "slow but stable" in the handling department. A little numb, perhaps. Admittedly no major bumps or stuccato surfaces were involved. The NIX on the other hand seemed a bit too lively for my taste - will need to make a small tweak to the shim stack but overall it was pretty good.
 

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Guest 2wheeler
and cue @2wheeler 's thoughts on riding the NIX thru Clifton this weekend. 
I rode his, obviously, with just a spring change and my magic thicker oil mix (JK) and while there were a number of other factors at play, my changes to his forks felt pretty damn good but felt "slow but stable" in the handling department. A little numb, perhaps. Admittedly no major bumps or stuccato surfaces were involved. The NIX on the other hand seemed a bit too lively for my taste - will need to make a small tweak to the shim stack but overall it was pretty good.

My thoughts about the NIX was that the front end felt very good, but I am not sure how much of that was the NIX or the difference in tires. 
My bike has the Battleax 023s, while Matt's bike has the Michelin PR3s. Overall I was amazed at the difference in the tires. They seemed to ride much smoother and handle much better.
 
Having said that, I previously posted that I was blown away by what a difference in just changing the springs and the oil made. Matt seems to concur that the setup works.
 
There will be a set of PR4s coming in the spring. I had it in my mind that I was going for the Pirelli Angel GTs based on reviews, but actually riding a different set of tires on my model of bike speaks way more than some reviewers thoughts.
 
 
 

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rick
New tires will always feel a million times better than old/worn tires - regardless who made 'em.
 
Modern tires are just so dang good - let's talk about tubed, bias-ply tires that were available in the 70s.

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pattonme
let's talk about tubed, bias-ply tires that were available in the 70s.
I believe they were the cause of many a calling on one's favorite deity.

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Guest 2wheeler
New tires will always feel a million times better than old/worn tires - regardless who made 'em.  
Modern tires are just so dang good - let's talk about tubed, bias-ply tires that were available in the 70s.
The catch is that both the Michelins and the Bridgestones have about the same amount of miles on them. I may have about 800 more miles on my Bridgestones. Heck, I can't wait to see what a new set of tires will feel like. 

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rick
Same number of miles can be misleading - riding style and the roads travelled can have a huge influence on how a set of tires wears. Stay upright on the interstate and tires het worn down the middle. Seen a lot of time on windy 2ndary roads and the wear gets distributed more evenly.
 
New tires will almost always make the steering feel magically lighter

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rick
let's talk about tubed, bias-ply tires that were available in the 70s.
I believe they were the cause of many a calling on one's favorite deity.
My 2nd BMW ('82 R100RS) teeter-tottered about at near triple digit speeds (85 mph speedo days, so not exactly sure how fast we were going after the needle pegged)and that bike had an added fork brace, machined alloy upper bridge, and shocks with actual rebound adjusters (oh baby, 3 clicks of adjustment!). Had a passenger once ask me if it was suppose to do that little dance mid-sweep. "Yep, all the time". Weebles wobbled, but they never fell down. lol 
Deity or no, I'm just happy to have survived the "good ol'" days.
 

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Guest 2wheeler
Same number of miles can be misleading - riding style and the roads travelled can have a huge influence on how a set of tires wears. Stay upright on the interstate and tires het worn down the middle. Seen a lot of time on windy 2ndary roads and the wear gets distributed more evenly.  
New tires will almost always make the steering feel magically lighter
Yeah, my tires are getting that flat center spot with 5K mostly on 55+mph roads. You can tell they are going over an edge in a sharp corner when they transition off the flat spot. Plus, there is no telling what the other guys tire are inflated to. Having said that, most folks rave about the PR3s over the 023s, so whether there was a real difference or a perceived one, it's good enough for me to try them in the spring. 

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rick
Same number of miles can be misleading - riding style and the roads travelled can have a huge influence on how a set of tires wears. Stay upright on the interstate and tires het worn down the middle. Seen a lot of time on windy 2ndary roads and the wear gets distributed more evenly.  
New tires will almost always make the steering feel magically lighter
Yeah, my tires are getting that flat center spot with 5K mostly on 55+mph roads. You can tell they are going over an edge in a sharp corner when they transition off the flat spot. Plus, there is no telling what the other guys tire are inflated to. Having said that, most folks rave about the PR3s over the 023s, so whether there was a real difference or a perceived one, it's good enough for me to try them in the spring.
Well, keep in mind that the 023s are now 2 generations old - and the PR3s are also pretty old now. They were replaced by the T30s a few years ago and now the newer T30 Evos have been around long enough that Bridgestone will be working on improving them. Not saying the PR4s are not worth trying. Never heard any complaints on them. Just saying what you would buy current from Bridgestone is far better than the 023s our bikes came with. 

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pattonme
as much as tires are a fun discussion, this *was* about the NIX-22... I updated the charts to keep the scale comparable.
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Rmbukk

Random but on topic question, are the adjusters in clicks or turns? As in the manual is states recommended settings in clicks but when adjusting a friends nix kitted bike the rebound adjusters turned and no clicking was felt.. we were both a bit baffled

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