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FZ-07 vs KTM Duke 690?

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Guest 2wheeler
Owning neither of them, what are the main differences? Would one be better than the other?

I didn't realize that you do not own a FZ-07. You've been on this site for over 9 months now, and asking/posting all kind of interesting thoughts. 
So... when are you going to just pull the trigger and buy a FZ-07???
 
The FZ-07 with a bare minimum of heavier fork springs, heavier fork oil and a flash is a freaking awesome motorcycle. While I have not owned a lot of motorcycles (40-50 at present guess), I have only ridden one bike that I feel was in the same league with the FZ (in many senses) and that was the BMW F800GS which is $5300 more expensive and 75lbs heavier.
 
Just a thought
 
 
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Beemer
[attachment id=2277" thumbnail="1]< "I wonder how much fun I could've had riding instead of thinking about the ultimate ride?"
 
 
 
 
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Beemer

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rick
I have a buddy who had a 2009 Duke 690 until just a month or so ago. Sadly, that bike was just too dang tall for me to ride, so I can't really give more than his impressions. The Duke has changed twice since that bike. The 1st change saw the fully adjustable suspension and loads of pretty aluminum bling disappear in the quest to hold the price down. It also gained a lower and more comfy saddle. The current version has undergone some more FI changes and I believe has gained a bit of HP. Is it faster than the FZ, hmm, might depend on who's whacking the throttle open.
 
So, 1st off, if you think the FZ is light, hah, the Duke is even lighter. Even w/o adjustments, the OE suspension on the Duke is likely better than the FZ's bargain basement bits. Fuel mileage, as good as it is on the FZ, is probably still better with the Duke - (don't want to get into what will turn into an discussion on this, but it comes down to cylinder wall surface area and how much heat/power is lost thru that area. The more cylinders, the worse the gas mileage in general) The equalizer will be a smaller tank on the Duke. And the thumper will also produce coarser vibes.
 
Where the FZ wins - way more stuff available in the aftermarket. You might be able to find a windscreen for the Duke, you'd have 10 to choose from for the FZ. Parts - if needed - will not only be far cheaper for the FZ, but way easier to find. There's exactly one KTM shop that handles the road bikes in this entire corner of PA. It's where I bought my FZ - I won't ever go back. 
 
I looked at the Duke a couple years ago when i was looking for a lighter bike. When the FZ came out, well, it was a no-brainer. I'm sure the Duke is a fun motorcycle. The guy my friend sold his to is loving every second. BTW, that friend is now riding a SuperDukeR 1290! Can you say stupid fast and twice the money?
 
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piebald
I owned both a 2014 Duke 690 and a 2015 FZ-07 at the same time. While I was shopping for an FZ last winter, I came across a Duke 690 at a really good price, so I bought it. A few months later, I found my FZ-07 and after riding both in varying conditions, sold the Duke.
 
For me, the Duke 690 was an absolute hoot to ride -- a complete grin machine -- provided you were riding aggressively on curvy roads, twisting wrist and accelerating hard or decelerating hard. Long, open stretches at highway speeds were way more comfortable on the FZ-07. The Duke engine is awesome, but since it's a thumper, it's a vibey son of a gun. The FZ motor seems much smoother and more refined.
 
I wanted a good all-rounder (round-town commuter, day trips into the mountains, a few multi-day tours, and the occasional track day), so the FZ really fits the bill.
 
The Duke 690 (for me personally) seemed much more specialized and would make the ULTIMATE canyon carver. It's crazy fun when you're braking hard or accelerating aggressively, lofting the front wheel out of a deep corner. But, droning stretches of back roads and highway were uncomfortable compared to the FZ-07.
 
Both bikes made me grin like an idiot, but the FZ-07 won me over. Super versatile.
YMMV.
 
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ddog
The duke 690, and ktm's in general are tightly wound performance machines. Their motto "ready to race" really says it all. That being said, you're going to make sacrifices for a machine like that; comfort, service intervals, and lifespan are all going to be lower on the 690 because it is built to push limits. I have very similar performance characteristics on my modded out fz07 to my buddy's 2014 ktm 690 smc. He also has it on the bench about 3 times as often as I do with the fz07. We both love our bikes, and I wouldn't trade, but neither would he.
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gregjet
We have both. Sally has a KTM690 Duke 2013 ( gen4) and I have an MT07(2015).
What do you want to know.
Some points:
The 690's has been even more poorly fueled than the 07. This is fixable, but NOT by power commander, as it has 2 very sneaky separate fuel loops. I believe it can be reflashed now to give better smoother performance. The word is that the latest version ( gen5) does not suffer from the same fuel stumble. We installed a couple of devices made in Australia ( one for each fuel loop) that finally allowed us to get proper throttle response. The map switch is actually useable especially the rain setting. The "insane" position is a bit pointless except for cracking whjeelies. All it does is quicken the fly by wire throttle opening. Even people racing them tend to use the normal position.
OEM suspension on the KTM is exemplary ( on the 2013). Not perfect but outstanding for a stock bike. The 07's suspension is it's biggest weak point. It is fixeable. Be aware that the R version of the Duke is actually HIGHER seat height and , in my opinion, suffers from pitching a bit.
The 07 is way smoother engine wise. The duke vibrates a bit.
Both have ridiculously small fuel tanks.
On our big trip , I would continually hear Sally say " have I told you how comfortable this seat is on the KTM. Sally has been riding motorcycles for nearly 50 years so she has a fair idea. I finally got fed up with the 07 seat and got a Seat Concepts pad/cover. Worth every penny.
Very different handling ( even with my suspension fixed). Interestingly enough , in my opinion, their characters are the opposite way to what you would think. The 07 responds best to getting forward motard style and pushing into the corner. The Duke actually rails around , despite it's KTM heritage. Neither bike needs huge lean angles as they are pretty light but the Duke has a better ( read smaller) rear tyre despite having more power and being lighter so swaps sides MUCH easier. Duke front is much better planted.
Both need the stock exhaust chucked, but the KTM more so than the 07. The duke cat box is insanely heavy.
The duke loves Michelin Pilot Road 4's.
Having a cast alloy rear subframe the duke requires serious design work to mount panniers if that is your desire. We did it but it too me a while to figure out how to spread the load safely.
Both bikes have good forums. I have found this forum to be the best FZ/MT07 one. ( This is the main Duke forum I use: http://www.ktmforums.com/forums/).
Duke's mirrors vibrate enough to be almost unusable. Sally now has bar end mirrors that work much better.
Anything else you want to know, just message me.
 
Sally's before the panniers and the new windscreen:
singleseatreplace5.jpg
 
Mine before mounting my touring screen:
20151026_153630.jpg
 
 
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Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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rick
My Buddy's Duke ate back tires for breakfast - drive chains as well.
 
The 2016 has some more refinements - including an extra balance shaft to soften the blow of that big piston. If the tank is really 3.7 gallons(not been able to put more than 3.4 into mine) , range will be better than the FZs.
 
Aside from a fuel pump issues, my friend's Duke was very reliable.

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gregjet
I forgot about the new balance shaft. That should fix the tingle problem a bit. Sally's back tyre has done over 7000km and is still good, but she is a pretty sedate rider nowdays, since her big accident.
On our big trip Sally got 220 to 260km before the reserve light went on. My 07 gets a lot better than that.

Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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level41
Interesting replies guys!
Nice bikes Gregjet!
 
From what I read,
The duke has a big price bump over the FZ (almost $1500 more tax incl.),
Aside from the engine and exhaust upgrades, the duke actually has received a second countershaft.
The engine, which makes more HP than before, now also vibes less according to reviews and experiences of riders on forums.
So if someone was to buy a duke, it would be a no brainer to get the 2016 version with all the upgrades for almost the same price.
 
I do find that the nose and tail look like they're chopped off, very short on the Duke.
On second view, the FZ looks pretty much the same.
 
I've read that the riders on the FZ find themselves almost floating above the front wheel.
I wonder what the riders of the Duke find, as they are much closer to the front wheel.

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sansnombre
I've read great things about the Duke, esp in the twisties. BUT, the word is it's anemic under 3k and the FZ pulls much better there. There was a comparison recently that i read online (http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/suzukis-sv650-takes-on-the-competition and http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/2014-middleweight-mash-six-way-shootout-video/8) and they gave the number one spot to the FZ and the number two to the Duke in 2014.
 
The Duke is a big chunk lighter (~40 pounds) and is torquey, but the torque is not linear at all. It's all over the place, so it really could use some intake/jetting help. It looks like some big differences in the new one over the 2014 though . . .
 
I really, really like the idea of a superlightweight Duke with a bunch of torque, but I don't want to have to slip the clutch to get rolling, so I'm on the FZ.
 
 
 

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rick
Keep in mind that the wheelbase of the Duke is 57.7" and the FZ's is only 55". It's kinda deceptive to just look at picts.
 
 

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gregjet
Talking of slip and clutch, I forgot to mention Sally's version has a slipper clutch, but not sure if the current one has.
 
sansombre has a good point I forgot. The 07 will happily ( especially after a ecu reflash) roll at town speeds in 5th and even 6th. The Duke will not. 3rd max gear at 60kph ( 4th with the loop modifiers). Chugs a fair bit if not at the proper useable revs. Again that is supposed to be improved BUT bear in mind most people gear the Duke DOWN a bit ( stealth sprockets are available for the Duke but not the 07). I personally would gear the 07 UP and will when I have to get a new chain.The gearing and the motor makes the 07 a bit more realxed to ride casually.
 
And rick's point is also true. Sally sits on mine and says it feels short ( and she is 5'3") compared to hers. Even with the Woodcrafts on it.
Not really important but the KTM has beautiful light wheels. And a proper sized for these bikes 4" rear rim so fits a better ( IMHO) sized and cheaper rear tyre (160/60).

Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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jimme
I traded in a Duke 390 (my first bike) for my FZ07. Dukes (both 390 & 690) from my experience and what i have read don't like to be below 4k rpm at all. By comparison the FZ seems buttery smooth. the Duke however is way lighter and feels almost dirtbike like even though i know the 390 is smaller the 690 isn't much more heavier.

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rick
Speaking of those KTM wheels. I don't know why or what it is about them, but tire swaps on those wheels is by far the easiest of any tire changes I've ever done - and that's 46 years of doing tires myself. Even that big 190/50 on my buddy's SDukeR was silly easy. We just pulled the 2nd bead of old tire off by hand. The new tire went on just as easily. We went from a bit of concern over the size of that tire to WTF, that was just too easy. It was almost like we had the wrong size tires at hand. 
 
That same friend had a ZRX1200 Kaw - by far and away, at the other end of the ease spectrum - as in no ease at all. If the kaboom's wheels (both 690 and the 1290) are a 2 and 1 respectively, my April's wheels are a 2.5 and the 2 Kaws I've done in recent history ( a ninja 250 is the other) are a 7 for the midget tires on the 250 and 9 for the Rex. Gotta leave some room just in case I ever do a Diavel back tire, lol.
 
If the Euro vs. Japanese theme continues, I'm expecting some work for an FZ tire change.
 
I'm also thinking' a wee bit taller gearing for the FZ might be a good thing as well.
 
 

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tag
I put a deposit on a 2016 690 Duke and after 2+ months it never showed up. I took my deposit back, bought the FZ-07 and have been happy ever since.

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hamster
This happens to brands such as KTM, Aprilia, MV Agusta... :S
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Safe riding!

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pattonme
I took my deposit back, bought the FZ-07 and have been happy ever since.
Not to mention the yahoos on the KTM forums are a lower class of human. :) JK - hey I own 2 KTMs, and one is a 2005 690SM
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rick
This happens to brands such as KTM, Aprilia, MV Agusta... :S
Hmm, MV is kinda dead, so one shouldn't expect much. I've never seen one in person, there's never been a dealer even close. 
Just when Aprilia hit it big with the V60 version of the Tuono back in the early 2000s, it dang near went under and the dealer network pretty much went with it. There's a dealer here, but I just have parts shipped from Af1 in Texas. 
 
Dunno what to make of KTM. The bikes are awesome, if not a bit quirky and more than a bit expensive. KTM sells a lot of motorcycles around the world, just not a lot here. And there's lots of KTM shops here, but only one sells the street bikes. On the same showroom floor there'll be an SV650 and an FZ7. That's stiff competition for the 690. 
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tag

Just when Aprilia hit it big with the V60 version of the Tuono back in the early 2000s, it dang near went under and the dealer network pretty much went with it. There's a dealer here, but I just have parts shipped from Af1 in Texas. 
 

I had a 2004 Tuono with a little work on the motor and it was an amazing and wonderful bike. I've got nothing but praise for Aprilia. AF1 is a good bunch too. Reliable and they offer good advice. Good peeps.  That said, I love my little FZ even more.[span style=border-top-left-radius:2px;border-top-right-radius:2px;border-bottom-right-radius:2px;border-bottom-left-radius:2px;text-indent:20px;width:auto;padding:0px 4px 0px 0px;text-align:center;font-style:normal;font-weight:bold;font-size:11px;line-height:20px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, sans-serif;color:rgb(255, 255, 255);background-image:url(data:image/svg+xml;background-color:rgb(189, 8, 28);opacity:1;border:none;background-position:3px 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat no-repeat]Save[/span][span style=border-top-left-radius:2px;border-top-right-radius:2px;border-bottom-right-radius:2px;border-bottom-left-radius:2px;text-indent:20px;width:auto;padding:0px 4px 0px 0px;text-align:center;font-style:normal;font-weight:bold;font-size:11px;line-height:20px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, sans-serif;color:rgb(255, 255, 255);background-image:url(data:image/svg+xml;background-color:rgb(189, 8, 28);opacity:1;border:none;background-position:3px 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat no-repeat]Save[/span]

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gregjet
The Suzi 650 , in my opinion, is a big heavy outdated lump of a motor. Was a revelation when it came out but , like it's brother the gs500, is just not been updated enough. It should be MUCH lighter than it is. Don't get me wrong , both the 500 and the 650 are exemplary bikes to own, but very dated, and heavier than they should be. I am currently doing a gs500 project aimed at seeing what can be updated/ lightened and it is a bit of an eye opener how dated a lot of stuff is.
Sally had an SV650 before the KTM and (now after fuelling changes)likes the Duke MUCH more. Even for touring.
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Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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hamster
This happens to brands such as KTM, Aprilia, MV Agusta... :S
Hmm, MV is kinda dead, so one shouldn't expect much. I've never seen one in person, there's never been a dealer even close. 
Just when Aprilia hit it big with the V60 version of the Tuono back in the early 2000s, it dang near went under and the dealer network pretty much went with it. There's a dealer here, but I just have parts shipped from Af1 in Texas. 
 
Dunno what to make of KTM. The bikes are awesome, if not a bit quirky and more than a bit expensive. KTM sells a lot of motorcycles around the world, just not a lot here. And there's lots of KTM shops here, but only one sells the street bikes. On the same showroom floor there'll be an SV650 and an FZ7. That's stiff competition for the 690. 
 
 
Exotics are difficult to find around - the reliability of MV and the after-sales + aftermarket is horrible... they are my favourite motorcycles in design, but the rest... :S
 
Aprilia is great, it is the slow aftermarket service and the limited showrooms that make it less easy. I think they are reliable, as every other brand, as long as you service it correctly.
 
If only I won the lottery... ?

Safe riding!

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gregjet
I think Marchesini's have an unusually deep rim well but can't confirm it. That would help explain the ease of tyre change.
 

Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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rick
Could very well be. We were really expecting a struggle with that big 190/50 and it just didn't happen. But whether the smaller width wheel on the Duke or that big one on the SDR, they are definitely less work - a deeper well can't hurt. Haven't done a front on the SDR yet, but I'm not expecting it to be different.
 
Those Marchesinis are also really pretty wheels. They're powder coated inside nearly as nicely as they are outside - unlike the the paint jobs that japanese wheels sorta get inside. My Aprilia's wheels are pretty close in quality to the Marchesinis - though I don't know who made 'em. The FZ's wheels have not gained much wheel by painting them, if ya get my drift. Breath on 'em too hard and black becomes silver
 
Call me crazy, i kinda like changing tires.

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