Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
databyter

So How Does This Suspension Upgrade Sound?

Recommended Posts

databyter
A local shop is suggesting, and has given me a quote for a Wilber's 640 rear shock, and rebuilding my front forks with new spring, and a Gold Valve Cartridge EMulator kit, new seals, oil, and adapters etc..
 
The prices seem fair for the components themselves, and the labor is a bit high, but probably worth it. They seem to know what they are doing in there.
 
The WIlbers shock seems like a good brand. I have seen the name compared with Ohlins online. The emulator kit and spring seems like a good way to go as well, but what do I know.
 
I did a bit of research, there is a Wilbers 641 with more adjustment for a nice tick up in price, but I am guessing I probably wouldn't need that level of tune unless I was racing or something?
 
Thanks in advance
 
P.S. Opps, I guess I should mention my weight and riding style. I am about 190 (guessing,  I haven't weighed myself in several decades). I commute 25 miles each way every day, rain or shine, and speed like a bat outta hell when it is safe to do so. I find myself in 3 digit speeds now and then. I mostly ride on freeways for commute, but I want to start riding in the back Country mountains and roads in SD County, and probably some of those famous LA rides as well. SO I want a good suspension for high speed, that is also good for twisties and rough potholed and repaired roads.
 
Databyter
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
gregjet
Hopefully @pattonme will chime in here.
ANY positive upgrade on the stock suspension will help. It's bloody aweful stock as it appears you have already discovered.
I have never used wilber's shocks so ,hopefully, someone else will be able to comment ( my preference is Ohlins, but I ended up with Nitron).
I have used GVE's extensively and I recommend them ( not exclusively). I put tham in as advised by the supplier but later found substantial modification recommented by racetec ( after I had already got a kit from Matt).
The spring will have to be upgraded as noted and I weigh about the same as you. I cut and reset mine so they were 8% stiffer than stock.
The GVE's were a huge improvement however note the following. NOTE I am using it for ROAD work only. Not track work.
Used the BLUE spring not the yellow. 2 turns in.
I drilled 2 extra 1mm low oscillation holes in the centre plate.
Run 10 wt oil NOT 15 as advised ( or between 10 and 15), if leaving the rebound hole stock.
Pattonme will have more constructive stuff to say I have no doubt. I trust him, I bought his fork kit and had it shipped to Aus and it isn't reversible. Not sorry.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pattonme
Ultimately how much do you want to spend and how close to "perfection" and tweaking flexibility do you want to go? If you really want to get into suspension and tinker with this or that then the more knobs to twist the more you'll learn, assuming you don't end up getting lost.
 
If you're looking for 'good enough' the GVE or Ricor Intiminator and springs will get you ~80% there after you figure out what oil to use. Rear shock, the 640, budget Ohlins, or better yet a Nitron, Matris or JRi 350 Pro. I had a 641 and liked it a lot. It was a lot cheaper than the Penske 8987 series at the time and I spent a goodly number of afternoons testing and tweaking the various settings till I was happy. That was for street use (yes, I eventually did track days on that bike) but if your roads are gnarly unlike the glass smooth tarmac of WVa, then some of these tuning options can be handy.
 
Once you taste a fork cartridge (Andreani, Forks-by-Matt, Matris, Traxxion Dynamics, Ohlins) you'll wonder why anyone bothers with GVE/Intiminator - personal opinion and also multiple personal testimony of those who have tried both and logged many street or track miles. Not to say they are perfect out of the box (mine are, naturally. *grin*; the Matris and Andreani need some help) but the ability to easily change configuration and immediately feel the difference can be very satisfying. Cartridge solution will cost you $400+ whereas you can get the GVE or RIcor for around $200.
 
In the end you can pick from a variety of fork+shock solutions that cost ~800 up to $2000+.
You can see some of those price points here:
http://fz07.org/thread/4282/holiday-andreani-fork-shock-special
http://fz07.org/board/32/traxxion-dynamics-total-suspension-solutions
http://fz07.org/thread/1920/fork-upgrades-compatible-swaps
http://fz07.org/thread/1914/shock-upgrades-compatible-swaps
 
Let me know if I can be of further service.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
databyter
Well the shop that I got the estimate from is talking about 1500ish including labor for emulator forks, and the 640 less adjustable WIlber. Re the wilbers, I guess the upside is that Wilber sets them up for you using your specs and so you don't need to build them out yourself, nor does your shop if you go that way. THey are also rebuildable so once you make the original investment, I guess you can spend less next time is the logic.
But you are saying I can have a reliable, quality cartridge solution for much less than the emulator that ALMOST can do the same thing?
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pattonme
All of the good shocks are fully rebuild-able. Suspension is a wear item and will require service in 15K miles or 3 years if perhaps sooner. A shock refresh is about $200. About same for forks too.
 
As far as 'custom built for you' is concerned the JRi or Penske (probably Nitron) is not any less than the Wilbers. The Matris, Ohlins, YSS are mass-market - the only thing they customize is which spring to put on.
 
As to forks, the only guys who tailor the shim stack to usage and spring rate are higher-end custom tuners like Traxxion, myself, Racetech and a handful of dedicated specialists (Lindermann, Thermos Man, Norwest, etc). Those who have a ready-made retail offering everybody gets the same cartridge config, just different springs. So Andreani, or Ohlins, (likely Matris - haven't seen enough units) you get the same shim stack no matter if you're 150 or 250lbs and running .8 or 1.0 springs. By comparison I change the shim stack for every step in spring rate. If you buy the Andreani kit from me, part of my value-add is the enhancements documented elsewhere but also that I overhaul the shim stack to suit spring selection ('DIY' and 'Installed' option). Do I really need that extra shim (or two) between a 0.9 and 0.95 setup? No. You can get there with turns on the needle. I just prefer that customers retain full adjustment range. But between 0.85 and a 1.0, you bet you need the extra shims.
 
> I can have a reliable, quality cartridge solution for much less than the emulator that ALMOST can do the same thing?
 
An emulator 'Almost' mimics a cartridge in the same way a slice of fresh out of the oven, home-made cherry pie with rich creamy french vanilla, compares to a slice of canned instant pie filling in a pre-made crust topped with a scoop of watery Walmart vanilla 'ice'. One is a dining experience. The other, sorta maybe tastes like cherry, or something.
 
$1500 for what you describe is very stiff asking price. The shock, emulators, and springs should come out to $600+150+70 = 830-900. $200 tops to install the GVE into your forks and if they are doing the fork/shock installation onto your bike, another 1 or 1.5hrs of shop labor rate.
 
Yes you can have a full-tilt cartridge fork and excellent shock (JRi) for less than you were quoted.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
batscat
I bought the rear shock from these guys they build them to your weight and have multiple shock brands.
http://www.epmperf.com/
I personally bought the Hyperpro 461.This shock has a remote reservoir = hose mounted, with adjustable high and low speed compression damping, adjustable rebound damping and threaded pre-load.
Comes with a free rebuild coupon.
And got my forks built by Forks by Matt.
Good luck on your journey its fun to make a bike "yours" and have it custom for your style/weight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  


×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.