Premium Member wickedtwister Posted July 25, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted July 25, 2015 I'd just get it from Yamaha. Probably won't be very expensive. McMaster Carr may have it but you need to know the exact thread size and pitch. This might be listed on the Yamaha parts films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 You could take your nut to the hardware store and try it on the sample bolts so you can find the thread size and then buy a replacement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 come on guys. do NONE of you walk around with a thread gauge in your pocket? I do. Or at least my GF keeps asking me if I'm happy to see her. ;-) A hardware store won't have the nut or a stud to test against. But they might have a thread gauge. @howlinhoss or @unknown, you guys around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howlinhoss Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 come on guys. do NONE of you walk around with a thread gauge in your pocket? I do. Or at least my GF keeps asking me if I'm happy to see her. ;-) A hardware store won't have the nut or a stud to test against. But they might have a thread gauge. @howlinhoss or @unknown, you guys around? Just catching up with this thread. How can I help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I have axle spools on mine. but if there's enough thread poking out the end, let me know, I can pop them off. I might have a die big enough. Thread gauge. Sheesh, a tool I don't own. The yamaha part was 6 or 7 bucks. Just order one with the rest of the stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pj Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Just happen to me this past friday to. Ive taken my axle and nut back to the dealer and they are currently calling yamaha to see if it will fall in waranty. I was able to take mines of but the nut is made out of aluminum and totally stripped while I decided to take it off. The mechanic at my dealer ship says looks like it was fused but I think the nut should of been more of a solid metal but who am I to say in an electrician who loves to ride and wrench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ornery Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I'm having trouble finding a 27mm castle nut. Where could I find out what size the threads are for the end of the axle? https://www.belmetric.com/cn18x15clz-castle-nut-zinc-p-3059.html?cPath=3_558 [/url]Metric Medium-Strength Class 8 Steel I think I'll snag one of these. I'm inclined to believe the nut on yours was the culprit, not anything you did. I sure as hell don't want to have this happen to me! Edit: Bah, that Nylon-Insert nut won't work the way it is. It's one inch thick and the nut it would replace is only 3/4", so it would have to be machined down. I just pulled mine off to take a look at the nut. I can see where those tabs getting deformed could cause this issue. As it is, mine goes on & off, and still has the locking effect, so I'll cross my fingers & leave it alone. Edit II: This size is altogether wrong! The nut hex size is 27mm not the ID. A few posts down, Rick found the correct size is M18 x 1.5: M18-1.5 DIN 985 Class 10 Zinc Finish Steel Nylon Insert Lock Nut Those are a good fit, in stock and will never ruin the bolt threads! I imagine a normal M18 x 1.5 hex nut with Locktite work as well: Loctite® Threadlocker Blue 242® “The real cycle you're working on is a cycle called yourself.” — Robert M. Pirsig (Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member wickedtwister Posted July 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted July 26, 2015 On my other bike there is a castle nut and a hole in the axle for a cotter pin. I like this more than the aluminum lock nut personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fflier9 Posted July 26, 2015 Author Share Posted July 26, 2015 I think I'll snag one of these. I'm inclined to believe the nut on yours was the culprit, not anything you did. I sure as hell don't want to have this happen to me! Are you sure the but you linked to has the correct thread pitch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ornery Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Nope, not sure, and it's 1/4" thicker, so if it is right, it would still have to be machined down a bit. I think that castle nut is also too thick. No room to drill a hole through the bolt without machining the nut down. Probably not worth the trouble. You might as well just purchase the correct set and hope it works better. Odds are in your favor, but no guarantee. Edit: In the following post, Rick found the correct size is M18 x 1.5: M18-1.5 DIN 985 Class 10 Zinc Finish Steel Nylon Insert Lock Nut “The real cycle you're working on is a cycle called yourself.” — Robert M. Pirsig (Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 took my axle spools off for a look. The axle threads are M18x1.5 I have a set of dies and that one spun on by hand. At near 80 ft-lbs, it's hard to imagine that thing coming loose. Looks like it's that last little thinned out thread on the nut that must be digging in. Might just file it off next time I have the axle out. For those, like me, using axle spools, If you drill a cross hole for a cotter or clevis pin, the spools will no longer work, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ornery Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Perfect Rick. Those would be available from Fastenal and function correctly with no chance of ever galling the threads: M18-1.5 DIN 985 Class 10 Zinc Finish Steel Nylon Insert Lock Nut That would cost $8.65 for five of them plus $8.72 to ship here UPS Ground. Gotta find something else to buy from them to make the order worthwhile... “The real cycle you're working on is a cycle called yourself.” — Robert M. Pirsig (Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Think I'd want one with a few more threads than what's pictured there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ornery Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 The picture is bogus. (It's the same image used for all sizes of their lock nuts) Thickness is 18mm (.71") high grade steel and that's a fine pitch. Pretty sure a normal M18 x 1.5 nut with Locktite would be just as effective, and again, no chance of binding up like the original. “The real cycle you're working on is a cycle called yourself.” — Robert M. Pirsig (Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member databyter Posted July 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted July 26, 2015 Great, something else to worry about. After seeing what the dealer did for first maintenance, I could hardly do worse. At least I will use the right wrench or socket and not a pair of vice grips or whatever chewed up mine. Good luck with the new set. That would be frustrating, especially since you were trying to be careful and actually used a torque wrench etc. Btw, as I have mentioned before on different threads, don't skimp on torque wrenches. Use a CDI or equivelant ( cheaper on Amazon than thru Snap-On or off a shelf). You can Chinese Craftsman almost everything else. My CDI torque wrench is so sexy I consider it foreplay. Really nice tool and pleasant to use. cheap insurance. No, I am not afiliated, just smart. By the way, I invested in the shop manual, and it is really good about telling you what is "one time use", and what nuts, bolts, washers, flanges etc. to replace when servicing/re-assembling. There is no mention of replacing the axle nuts for what it is worth. That doesn't mean we shouldn't if we feel we should. Databyter Databyter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member wickedtwister Posted July 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted July 26, 2015 I would personally go for the deformed steel lock nut vs the Nylon insert lock nut. over time nylock nuts "wear out". The deformed steel ones last longer and are better for applications where they are submitted to high heat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ornery Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I'm sure that's why Yamaha used this nut in the first place, but I'm also sure they won't reimburse the OP for the replacement nut & bolt or riding time and repair time lost fixing this. “The real cycle you're working on is a cycle called yourself.” — Robert M. Pirsig (Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 By the way, I invested in the shop manual, and it is really good about telling you what is "one time use", and what nuts, bolts, washers, flanges etc. to replace when servicing/re-assembling. There is no mention of replacing the axle nuts for what it is worth. That doesn't mean we shouldn't if we feel we should. Databyter Even if it was meant to be replaced each time, it still needs to come off in order to replace it. It should unscrew w/o ruining other parts. I'm thinking some of these nuts (or maybe the axle threads) were not made properly as many of us have not had this problem. Let's not forget, the OP didn't even removeit, he just loosened and then torqued it down. Next time I have mine off, I might just take that thin tab off the last thread of the nut and use a drop of blue Loctite. I'm not expecting to touch that nut until I need a new back tire, however, so it's gonna be a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwpowere36m3 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Properly torqued, the axle nut shouldn't come loose... even with anti-seize/lubricant applied. On two of my bikes, the axle nut is "castellated" and the axle-end is drilled for a cotter-pin (I use a "r-clip", reusable). With anti-seize applied and the nut torqued, I have never found it to have loosened. The cotter-pin is merely a safety back-up in case the nut wasn't tightened properly in the first place or not checked for a VERY long time. Granted, I have the nut off every couple of thousand of miles for some maintenance, so it gets checked periodically. Nylocs are nice, but they can't be re-used nearly as often as "fuji-nuts" and you don't have to worry about the plastic (locking material) melting under certain conditions. Also when a "fuji-nut" looses its "bite", some thread-locker can be applied. Personally I think a little too much is being made of all this... just replace the damaged hardware, lubricate the axle shaft lightly with some grease, lubricate the threads lightly with anti-seize and torque up the nut. Done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Frickin' Yamaha just had to choose an uncommon/rare size and pitch combination! Another source: https://www.boltdepot.com/Product-Details.aspx?product=6881 I expect the source of the problem is factory over-torque - there is absolutely NO excuse for this. Computer-controlled torque wrenches are SOP the world over since what, at least 10 years ago? And if using traditional, then it's also REQUIRED that the wrenches be tested for calibration on a regular basis. 80lt/lb is just stupid tight and not necessary. And frankly I'm not sure a 1.5mm pitch is appropriate for torque that high. I also expect the nut manufacturer has quality issues in materials if not tooling. I wouldn't go any higher than 70ft/lb and that's 'dry'. If you use blue locktite or anti-seize take 10lbft off. Anything over 50ft/lb and you're fine. You can wrap some safetywire on the end of the axle if you want but if the nut comes loose you'll feel it pronto. Never had one come loose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 If you go Ny-lock (is there enough engagement for the Nylon to actually grab?) I would check it more often, especially during the first week or two just to make sure. Set your torque wrench to 10 less than your initial and make sure it clicks without moving the fastener. If it's stable, then you're good to go, long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 One other possibility. I think there's enough threads showing on the axle to use a thin jam after the axle nut. 25 or 30 ft lbs would be enough to lock both in place. Not sure why the nylock is cheaper than the basic nut - but here, get a couple of each http://www.mrmetric.com/metric-fasteners/sc4z-metric-jam-nut/?search=M18x1.5+nut&ext=F 6 bucks shipping, no min order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etorty Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Hello all, the same problem happened to me this morning. I was gone to the tyre service for the first tyre change (16k km, thanks Battlax BT-023), the rear axle nut was locked. No way to unscrew the nut. I'm gone to my official Yamaha service, the mechanic noted that the clip instead to the self-locking nut was misaligned for one of the two sections. The only way to solve the problem is grind the nut until the clip can go off of the nut. Second pass, they will change the axle, the nut and (I think) the two silver plates. I'll update as soon as the work will be done, in the next hours. [div][/div][div][/div] www.MT-Series.it Yamaha Official MT-Series Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Clearly there's something wrong with the manufacture of at least some of these nuts. this should not be happening. In my hands, I would take a Dremel with a carbide bit and grind the outer threads of the axle and any part of that nut I could get at. That way, at least the adjusters will (should) be OK. 10k miles, nothing to sneeze at for a tire these days. With the 023s now obsolete, the temptation for a Bridgestone enthusiast to go with the T30, its replacement. The sideways on that tire are super, super, stiff - I have one in the que for my Futura. I'm half looking forward to the challenge of mounting it and half dreading the potential it's gonna be a real pita. It'll be a bit overkill (too much tour, not enough sport) for the FZ, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etorty Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Yes, there's clearly something wrong with some nuts... Today the mechanic at my Yamaha dealer has grinded the original nut, and the silver plate too, because the nut and the clip was really locked. The axle was damaged a little (that wasn't a surprise...), but he had already planned to use a rear set (axle, nut, left silver plate) from a new 07 in the store. In the meantime, the request for the replacement parts under warranty is on the way. The new nut from the 07 that was in store have the two clips in different position, the same position of the old nut. One of the clips is a little rotated in order to follow the thread of the axle, the other clip was plane, and the suspect that the problem will be the same after some months is real. The solution?? For me: change the nut. And the only reliable nut that I know is the Gilles Tooling's nut (titanium, with an interesting locking system). I've ordered this nut a few minutes ago. http://www.hotnrare.com/it/dettaglio.php?ACCESSORIO=GTACM-18-15 Sadly, the price of this nut is expensive... but thanks to the old nut I've wasted one day, and I have to work, like all of us... www.MT-Series.it Yamaha Official MT-Series Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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