fflier9 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I was wondering what y'all thought about this. Right around $500 w/ int'l shipping after euro conversion. Adjustable compression and rebound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I would love to get my hands on this kit to do an eval (a forum member joked about having Matris send me one for review...). One particular upside to this kit is that there is ZERO need to alter the upper fork tube. In the Andreani you are instructed to gut the bottom. In mine, I knock the seal out. In this one, the fake "damper rod" fits the stock seal. I can't duplicate the arrangement if for no other reason than it would add considerably to the price since these are totally custom from top to bottom, and they're using a spring that is at least 4" shorter than the Sonic ones. Traxxion has springs that are about 2" shorter but I don't know of a mass-market source for something that short. But if you're Matris' you have your own bulk spring supplier who can do it, no problem. Like the Andreani it's most likely a 2-valve system but I suspect there's an error in the picture since the holes on both legs are in the same place. If there is no error, then it would have to be a 4-valve system with the difference being the C leg has high-bypass shim stack on the underside of the piston so that there is ~no rebound control, and a suitably light stack on the top-side instead of the traditional pop-off. Man, everyone now wants in on the cartridge mod at ever decreasing price points. Now, what's Yamaha HQ's excuse for failing to engage Matris to be their OEM supplier? If reseller can sell Matris' kit with profit margin for 400E then for pete's sake it would add what 300-400E tops to the MSRP and Yam would clean the clock of every other $7000USD bike offering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulibiker Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I would love to get my hands on this kit to do an eval (a forum member joked about having Matris send me one for review...). One particular upside to this kit is that there is ZERO need to alter the upper fork tube. In the Andreani you are instructed to gut the bottom. In mine, I knock the seal out. In this one, the fake "damper rod" fits the stock seal. I can't duplicate the arrangement if for no other reason than it would add considerably to the price since these are totally custom from top to bottom, and they're using a spring that is at least 4" shorter than the Sonic ones. Traxxion has springs that are about 2" shorter but I don't know of a mass-market source for something that short. But if you're Matris' you have your own bulk spring supplier who can do it, no problem. Like the Andreani it's most likely a 2-valve system but I suspect there's an error in the picture since the holes on both legs are in the same place. If there is no error, then it would have to be a 4-valve system with the difference being the C leg has high-bypass shim stack on the underside of the piston so that there is ~no rebound control, and a suitably light stack on the top-side instead of the traditional pop-off. Man, everyone now wants in on the cartridge mod at ever decreasing price points. Now, what's Yamaha HQ's excuse for failing to engage Matris to be their OEM supplier? If reseller can sell Matris' kit with profit margin for 400E then for pete's sake it would add what 300-400E tops to the MSRP and Yam would clean the clock of every other $7000USD bike offering. You thinking Matris maybe a little better then the Andreani? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 Purely based on pictures and product description, I would wager that yes, it's pretty likely to be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzid1320 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Wow, this is only slightly more than the Traxxion Dynamics damper kit with emulators. Having never done a conversion like this before, would the install be within the realm of a weekend mechanic, or should this go to a professional shop? Most of my experience is on cars, from building engines to rear ends, but I leave auto trannys and suspension setup to the pros with the right tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fflier9 Posted July 15, 2015 Author Share Posted July 15, 2015 Patton, what is the difference between the kit you commented on above and Matris' "old" cartridge kit (aside from adjustable compression and rebound)? I like the fact that you don't have to alter the fork tube. I would send my forks to you in an instant after lurking here for a while, but with school and work I can't be down for more than maybe a lucky 24 hour stretch. No car... Also, what is the difference between this Matris rear shock, and this one, with integrated hydraulic spring preload? What is the benefit of having hydraulic preload over spring preload, and must you purchase a separate tool to add gas? Are these even good shocks for someone on a budget? Hope it's not too many questions. Just trying to figure out what to do. gotta ride every day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 what is the difference between the kit you commented on above and Matris' "old" cartridge kit The Matris FY125SE (your link) isn't remotely a cartridge kit. It's their re-spin on the Gold Valve Emulator. Instead of being tuned by a spring-loaded plate, the Matris unit uses a shim stack. Said valve still fits into the damper rod like the GVE does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fflier9 Posted July 15, 2015 Author Share Posted July 15, 2015 ahhh gotcha. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Also, what is the difference between this Matris rear shock, and this one, with integrated hydraulic spring preload? What is the benefit of having hydraulic preload over spring preload, and must you purchase a separate tool to add gas? Are these even good shocks for someone on a budget? Assuming the valving is up to snuff, they are better than the Ohlins offering by virtue of the ride-height adjustment. Being able to adjust ride-height is one of the more important controls IMO. I doubt the preload adjuster is actually hydraulic at all, but rather just a screw+worm gear setup which is becoming more common. It should be rather more convenient to adjust compared to skinning your knuckles trying to spin the traditional ring. However the dual-ring method has no limits to adjustment, whereas the (hydraulic or otherwise) adjustment probably only has a range of 10-15mm. If you need more than that you probably have to take the spring off, reposition the adjuster (might need a shim or it could just be a set-screw) and re-install the spring. Yes, I consider them worth a purchase. The feature set is equivalent to the Nitron Sport. All shocks come pre-charged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy2100 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 I would love to get my hands on this kit to do an eval (a forum member joked about having Matris send me one for review...). ... I ordered one today. For the "science" experiment, I could pay to ship it plus my forks to you in exchange for you installing it and you paying to ship it back to me. Any supplies/parts/upgrades would be paid by me. Time frame would be the second half of August. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 would the install be within the realm of a weekend mechanicHell yes. If it wasn't for the blasted bushing being wrong, you could do this without separating the halves; basically not too much more involved than an on-bike spring change. but do replace the bushings if you're doing any fork work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gigero Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 I would love to get my hands on this kit to do an eval (a forum member joked about having Matris send me one for review...). ... I ordered one today. For the "science" experiment, I could pay to ship it plus my forks to you in exchange for you installing it and you paying to ship it back to me. Any supplies/parts/upgrades would be paid by me. Time frame would be the second half of August. Any updates on this? I'd be interested in your thoughts on performance and the adjustability of the cartridges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 well, I'm afraid it's still on the calendar for 2nd half of August. Unless maybe I shell out the money and @randy2100 buys the kit off of me... I've got a few interested guys who want a review on Triumph RAT, too. I just don't want to get stuck with it. Anyone willing to do a 'firm' commit to take it off my hands after the review? Free shipping CONUS from me to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy2100 Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 They have my money, no shipping info so it's wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy2100 Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Box of fork cartridges is on it's way from Italy. I'll post some pics when it arrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffin Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 looking forward to hearing more about this setup, but dang one has to be patient to wait a month or more after purchase..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etorty Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 Box of fork cartridges is on it's way from Italy. I'll post some pics when it arrives.Wow! I hope you can mount the cartridges very soon: this upgrade is the most interesting for me too, and I'm planning to upgrade the mono at the same time. randy2100, do you have done any improvement to the rear suspension? www.MT-Series.it Yamaha Official MT-Series Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 Looks like the preload adjustment is also a bit more traditional and will give a bigger range and easier to keep track of due to the index lines. Remember that conversation about the Andreani being "track use only" and that's maybe why the compression is so stiff? . Well the lawyers are once again at work. And this is likely why Yamaha would not use them. They are more likely to use the UPS forks that already come on the FZ09 - which, btw, also don't work all that well. "Are Carpi Moto products street legal" ? "No, We are specialized in racing products, so except products whose description or detail form mentions the words "homologated" or "street legal", products that we sell are not street legal, they are not for highway use but only to use in closed circuits, fairs, sport events". I'm still on the bubble with installing my Andreani kit. I've finally gotten my Ohlins soft enough to give the compliance I was looking for and can now distinguish which end is wosre and feel my hands taking a pounding from that price-point fork. The point of no return on this kit is definitely a concern. Even with that 2.5wt fluid in the C side (and guys who are putting these into Bonnevilles are using 2.5wt fluid in both legs), I'm still a bit concerned about not being able to adjust out the impacts. In the meantime, I have a back tire and braided lines(still on OE - 13 years old now) to put on the Futura - and yeah, some painting up on a ladder to do,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 Sheesh, the stanchions are only $118. Can't get over how cheap parts are for this bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 Not to drift too wide of the thread topic @rick, but I ordered a couple sets of upper tubes from China - $120/pair including shipping. Look pretty good. I'll post pictures I guess. The fix to the Andreani is different pistons on the C leg, or at the very least flipping it over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy2100 Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 I have the Ohlins rear shock to go with these. The fork internals showed up today. The picture at http://www.carpimoto.it/en-US/45352_F15Y125K-Matris-F15-Fork-Cartridge-Kit-for-Yamaha-MT-07-.htm is accurate. The holes in both the compression and rebound legs are near the bottom and externally the two inserts are identical except for the label. The spring is labeled 9.0. The oil is 5W MOTOREX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etorty Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 Excellent! I can't wait for your report, when the internals will be on... 8-) 8-) Let us know! www.MT-Series.it Yamaha Official MT-Series Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member rowdy Posted August 11, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 11, 2015 Okay... I had to do it. I like my rear Matris KD shock so much that, a few weeks ago, I ordered a set of the F15s from PJ's. I was told they are on the way. Can't wait! Why can't left turners see us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etorty Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 @rowdy: Wow!! And you've replaced the mono with a Matris unit... Do you have the hydraulic preload installed or do you have the standard unit? I'm really interested to do a major upgrade to my suspensions, and Matris produce interesting and very good products. Let us know! www.MT-Series.it Yamaha Official MT-Series Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howlinhoss Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Nice kit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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