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rewplayff

Synthetic too soon?

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rewplayff
I have no idea why I changed get my oil to synthetic at 1100 miles. I could've sworn it was a thing to do at 1000. Then I tried looking it up again but could not find any info. Did I do it too soon and if so will I run into problems from it?

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rowdy
You can change to synthetic from mile 0 and it won't hurt anything.
I changed to full synth @ my first change which was about 400 miles.
 
 
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avanti
If the Manual says nothing regarding this and your selected oil meets Yamaha's specs all should be AOK. As for break-in with synthetics, many cars come new with Mobil 1 and have for years. All the best!
 

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gregjet
Avanti makes a good point unless Yamaha expects you to take it to a Yamaha dealer to have the oil changed. " if you have to open your rear passenger seat consult your Yamaha dealer"....
But Avanti is prob right, if it doesn't say it must be mineral oil for the first service then synth is not only alright but prob better. The piston/cyls that NEED mineral oil are the soft iron coated pistons that need the higher friction of mineral oil to polish the iron coat. I still havent ben able to ascertain if the MT has soft iron piston coatngs or not.

Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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rewplayff
Awesome. This all makes me feel much better. Still weird that I thought there was an oil change at 1000 miles. Maybe I got 600 miles and 1000km mixed up. But I did do the 600 one also.

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cavedog
You can change to synthetic from mile 0 and it won't hurt anything. I changed to full synth @ my first change which was about 400 miles.
 

I also switched to full synthetic around 400 miles, haven't had a problem.  Oil is oil, it's not like it doesn't lubricate.
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yamahaha
I have always changed to semi-synthetic or synthetic after the first 1000 kms. My bikes don't complain.

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gregjet
Mineral oil is better if the pistons are soft iron coated precisely because it DOESN'T lubricate as well. Allows sufficient friction for the iron coating and bore to polish each other. Synth is too slippery.

Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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thomascrown
I waited maybe 5000 miles before switching to synthetic.
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avanti
Some early C5 Vettes (that came from GM with full syn) had problems with oil consumption, traced to rings not breaking in properly. BUT, the issue was found to be the very low-tension rings that did not seat with enough pressure to break in as required... NOT synthetic oil use, which incorrectly floated around the Web at the time (and, probably always will). Sorry for the "cage" references on a bike site but it's what I know best and an engine is an engine.

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Guru
This is the schedule for oil changes according to Yamaha:
 
interval_oil.jpg
 
My 1000 Km was dealer dino oil. I then switched to full Synthetic Rotella at 5000 km.
My plan is to change the oil every year,which would be close to every 5000 km.
 
 

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Beemer
It doesn't matter when you switch. I just switched to full synthetic Motul 10W40 and it's working just fine. Back in the day when motor oils weren't as good there was a reason to change the oil every 3000 miles but that doesn't hold true now since motor oils are more advanced and synthetics are even better. Depending on how much stop and go riding you do, you could safely change your synthetic oil every 6000 -7500 miles or more. Even up to 10,00 miles but I'm doing mine every 6000. If you think about it, a lot of people can't or don't change their own oil on cars or bikes and a lot of dealerships know this, which would be beneficial to them to tell you to come in every 3000 miles for an oil change instead of 6000. It's funny how some manufacturers still recommend changing every 3000, they are stuck in their old ways and ignorant of the advancements or maybe there's a buddy system? (conspiracy!)  8-)

Beemer

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rowdy
Back in the day when motor oils weren't as good there was a reason to change the oil every 3000 miles but that doesn't hold true now since motor oils are more advanced and synthetics are even better.
I just have to add that engines (component tolerances, cylinder and head plating) have improved even more than oil. 
 
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sorkyah
It doesn't matter when you switch. I just switched to full synthetic Motul 10W40 and it's working just fine. Back in the day when motor oils weren't as good there was a reason to change the oil every 3000 miles but that doesn't hold true now since motor oils are more advanced and synthetics are even better. Depending on how much stop and go riding you do, you could safely change your synthetic oil every 6000 -7500 miles or more. Even up to 10,00 miles but I'm doing mine every 6000. If you think about it, a lot of people can't or don't change their own oil on cars or bikes and a lot of dealerships know this, which would be beneficial to them to tell you to come in every 3000 miles for an oil change instead of 6000. It's funny how some manufacturers still recommend changing every 3000, they are stuck in their old ways and ignorant of the advancements or maybe there's a buddy system? (conspiracy!)  8-)
I'm an apprentice tech at a chrysler/dodge dealership. Almost every one of our vehicles has a different mileage recommendation for oil service. The oil science is solid, but it all comes down to how the vehicle is used.
On average our 3.6l v6 engine can go between 2k and 8k depending on how it's driven. Also depends on the environment.
Out here in phoenix, az service intervals are greatly shortened due to the extreme heat and weather conditions.
 

ATGATT... ATTATT, two acronyms I live by.
 

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Guest Ralph
3.6l v6 engine can go between 2k and 8k
 
Read more: http://fz07.org/thread/3166/synthetic-soon#ixzz3gFYJD3iJ
 
Amazing my car as 17,000 mile service intervals they do recommend semi synth,
and that's with a turbo diesel, no valve adjustments and it has solid
lifters, running just as it did from new at 1100000 miles, mind you with service
prices in the UK if it had to be done every 2k it would be cheaper to buy a new
car every 4 years and not lay a spanner on it.
 

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gregjet
The latest science on oil lubricity I have seen, shows not a single oil tested had 50% slippery left after 1500miles . I change my oil every 3 to 5 thousand km in my cars and bikes. Until I see testing I trust, on a variety of oils, I am sticking to that.
Having said that I also use high quality diesel oil in my bikes, as testing shows it is perfectly good for the purpose ( NO friction modifiers and I use reasonable light synth).
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Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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Beemer
It doesn't matter when you switch. I just switched to full synthetic Motul 10W40 and it's working just fine. Back in the day when motor oils weren't as good there was a reason to change the oil every 3000 miles but that doesn't hold true now since motor oils are more advanced and synthetics are even better. Depending on how much stop and go riding you do, you could safely change your synthetic oil every 6000 -7500 miles or more. Even up to 10,00 miles but I'm doing mine every 6000. If you think about it, a lot of people can't or don't change their own oil on cars or bikes and a lot of dealerships know this, which would be beneficial to them to tell you to come in every 3000 miles for an oil change instead of 6000. It's funny how some manufacturers still recommend changing every 3000, they are stuck in their old ways and ignorant of the advancements or maybe there's a buddy system? (conspiracy!)  8-)
I'm an apprentice tech at a chrysler/dodge dealership. Almost every one of our vehicles has a different mileage recommendation for oil service. The oil science is solid, but it all comes down to how the vehicle is used. On average our 3.6l v6 engine can go between 2k and 8k depending on how it's driven. Also depends on the environment.
Out here in phoenix, az service intervals are greatly shortened due to the extreme heat and weather conditions.

I agree. City driving can wear an oil out faster than highway driving and as we all know, heat is the destroyer of engines. 
 
rowdy  Roger that!

Beemer

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avanti
Though metallurgy and machining have certainly improved dramatically, along with lubricants, the additive packages still break down. More than anything else, it is cheap and easy "insurance" to change oil and filters and most importantly, I FEEL better having done so on MY schedule, hehehehe!!!

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Guest Ralph
On my Morini it needed the valves doing every 1800 miles or so
but a switch to semi synth and not had to touch them for over
10,000 miles the rocker and shafts are lubed by oil mist that
collects on little fingers on the rocker box then drips if
you are lucky onto the valve gear so the shafts ware and open
up the clearances semi synth stops this there is no measurable
difference in the results from semi to fully synth.

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sguerrero
Today i changed the oil at 2,500 km to motul 7100 10W40. I can tell you I felt a great difference between Yamaha mineral oil.
 
Motor and gear chages run smoothly. I've noticed the most changes in the highway at 50 - 60 mph, vibration is reduced, motor sound less than before.
 
Let's see how it goes when I put more miles.

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gregjet
Sguerrero, Thanks for that. I have had issues with motul 4 stroke bike oil and gearboxes where it likes some bikes and is really mean to others ( my Cagiva Raptor with an sv650 motor would just become a pain in the butt to change gear with Motul in it). Earlier bikes had loved it.
 
"Heat is the destroyer of engines" the thing that causes "wear" in engines in not heat but lack of it ( usual heat not overhjeating of course). Repco established in the 60's that the major cause of piston/ring/bore and valve train wear was NOT friction but chemical attack caused by the build up of organic, nitrogen and sulphur based acids in the oil , from the combustion process and breakdown of the oil elements itself. The acids ( primarily) absorb into the oil on the cyl liner and accumulate in the oil. The oil has to heat sufficiently to "crack" the compounds into components and be expelled. Short city driving and low oil turnover ( low speed and idling) doesn't allow the oil to heat through enough for the cracking process throughout the oil. That is the reason modern oils are full of buffers. Older american, australian and english cars had notoriously slack rings which allowed a lot of blow by so suffered from it much more than modern cars do. Bigger bore cyl also suffer more than smaller ones becuase of ring tension and bigger end gaps
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Go forth and modify my son...go forth and modify...

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michaelcly
I know this is an old thread BUT I was told that some synthetic oils are too slippery and can cause a clutch slipping problem. For a bike with this kind of torque, I think it could be the case.
 
m
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2015 FZ07; Yoshimura Exhaust; Yoshimura Fender Eliminator; Shorty levers; Bazzaz EFC, frame sliders, LED signals, Yamaha Comfy Seat, Madstad Windshield.

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rick
I know this is an old thread BUT I was told that some synthetic oils are too slippery and can cause a clutch slipping problem. For a bike with this kind of torque, I think it could be the case. 
m
That's just nonsense!  
The only thing that would cause a wet clutch to slip is tons of friction modifiers that are put into car oils labeled as "Energy Conserving". As long as you stay with a motorcycle specific synthetic (or dino oil for that matter) or one of the HD truck oils like one of the 15w40 oils or even Mobil 1 car oil that is not got that EC label, the clutch will be just fine. 
 
As for torque, if you think this bike is a torque monster, well, you should have a look at the specs of the KTM 1290 SuperDuke R. Probaly puts out twice the torque and weighs only about 50 lbs more - that bike comes from the factory with full synthetic Motorex oil. Don't know for sure, but I would be surprised if any new BMW (now also with wet clutches) comes from the factory with oil other than full synth.
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Beemer
Today i changed the oil at 2,500 km to motul 7100 10W40. I can tell you I felt a great difference between Yamaha mineral oil.  
Motor and gear chages run smoothly. I've noticed the most changes in the highway at 50 - 60 mph, vibration is reduced, motor sound less than before.
 
Let's see how it goes when I put more miles.
That's what I've been using for awhile and even though it's slippery as hell ;)  everything works great on my FZ-07. The funny thing is I bought mine at the Yamaha dealership that was pushing the Motul over the Yamalube and @ $30 a gallon. I think that's a bargain for the best upgrade for a bike.
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Beemer

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rick
Gearboxes, even clutches work better with synthetic.
 
Put full synthetic gear oil into the box of my Subie Outback and it was an immediate transformation in shift quality.
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