2016 Fz07 issues

[Bsawyer]

Hello Names Brandon nice to meet you all. 

I've had my fz07 for 4 years now and been an amazing bike. But yesterday things got alittle weird and I don't know what the issues are specifically. Was in the mood to ride yesterday, started up bike like usual and rode it about half way to my fiences work , which is about 8 miles away. When all of a sudden when I came to a stop at a red light the bike idled super low and completely lost power up till it went above 3k rpm and then would drive normal again. Got to her work and kept testing things and bike will idle, but bounces between 800-1600 rpm and sounds like it wants to die. When driving it above 3k rpm bike runs perfectly fine other than when you try to give it a good amount of gas it just then wants to kill itself again. 

I did just put a fresh new full tank into it 3 days ago. 93 octane. And bikes at 22,560 miles

What are your thoughts? Fuel injectors/ spark plugs/ faulty fuel pump? I really don't know myself but would like an idea on your guys thoughts befor I start tearing the bike down. 

Ty all that comment to help! And happy riding 

Edited September 9, 2022 by Bsawyer
Adding info

[mjh937]

I would try unplugging the O2 sensor and see if that makes a difference.  I believe it is only used at lower RPM’s so if it is fine at higher RPM it may have failed.  You can unplug the wire just above where the sensor is.  I do not recall if I had to remove any trim to get to it (I removed mine too long ago to remember), but it is not to difficult if you do.  Make sure you secure the wire so it does not get damaged by the hot exhaust pipe. 

[Bsawyer]

Just now, mjh937 said:

I would try unplugging the O2 sensor and see if that makes a difference.  I believe it is only used at lower RPM’s so if it is fine at higher RPM it may have failed.  You can unplug the wire just above where the sensor is.  I do not recall if I had to remove any trim to get to it (I removed mine too long ago to remember), but it is not to difficult if you do.  Make sure you secure the wire so it does not get damaged by the hot exhaust pipe. 

I will give it a try tonight ty for the response and I'll post if it worked or not later

[Bsawyer]

On 9/9/2022 at 8:00 PM, mjh937 said:

I would try unplugging the O2 sensor and see if that makes a difference.  I believe it is only used at lower RPM’s so if it is fine at higher RPM it may have failed.  You can unplug the wire just above where the sensor is.  I do not recall if I had to remove any trim to get to it (I removed mine too long ago to remember), but it is not to difficult if you do.  Make sure you secure the wire so it does not get damaged by the hot exhaust pipe. 

made no diffrence

[mjh937]

Just now, Bsawyer said:

made no diffrence

I thought that was going to be the problem, at least that rules out the O2 sensor.  Hopefully someone will have another idea. 

[sweetscience]

Check or replace spark plugs, air filter, sync throttle bodies.  You're getting close for a valve clearance inspection.  Check battery health.  Is the stator fully charging the battery?

[shinyribs]

You mentioned putting "fresh" fuel in the bike. How old was the fuel in the tank already? 

 

And 93 octane is wasting your money. These bikes run perfect on 87. There's zero advantage to using higher octane. 

[DewMan]

Perhpas a throttle  body vacuum leak? Check the caps for the throttle body sync ports and any air lines attached to the throttle bodies.

[firstyammerha]

I've had luck with adding a fuel injector treatment to my cars and bikes a couple of times a year as a preventative maintenance routine No problems with driveability in over thirty years. 

[Bsawyer]

On 9/13/2022 at 4:12 PM, shinyribs said:

You mentioned putting "fresh" fuel in the bike. How old was the fuel in the tank already? 

 

And 93 octane is wasting your money. These bikes run perfect on 87. There's zero advantage to using higher octane. 

I daily drive this bike it's my mode of transportation. Now its the other bikes turn for the time being. I run it down to empty then fill it up. And saving myself the 2 dollars going to 87 doesn't concern me. 

 

On 9/13/2022 at 3:55 PM, sweetscience said:

Check or replace spark plugs, air filter, sync throttle bodies.  You're getting close for a valve clearance inspection.  Check battery health.  Is the stator fully charging the battery?

The spark plugs are my next thing on my list, that and taking a look at the airbox and throttle body I'll let you know when I tear the bike apart and take a look.

[sweetscience]

His bike could be tuned.  Tuned bikes generally run on high octane, if that's the case.  In my city, ethanol free gas is only available with premium fuel, so really not much choice.

[shinyribs]

I thought you might have been told that you need to run high octane. I was just letting you know that Yamaha sent these bikes out to be run on 87, so it's not necessary. Do with that what you want as it was a secondary comment anyway.

Modern fuels go stale FAST. Stale fuel acts exactly at you explained. Ethanol is the most prevalent octane booster used these days. Pure gasoline can't even reach 87 octane without additives. The higher the octane the more additives that are required. Ethanol wants to separate from gasoline while simultaneously sucking water out of the air. 

 

Dumping fresh fuel on top of old fuel ( I have no idea how long your bike sat previously) won't rejuvenate the old stuff already in the tank. If the previous fuel was stale ( volatiles evaporated) or water laden due to ethanol, all you can do is drain it or burn it out.

 

Might be all you got going on. Or you got a bad batch of fuel this time. It happens. A lot. Especially with high octane fuels since most vehicles don't require it and it often sits in the station's tank longer, sometimes absorbing water all the white. Higher octane won't clean anything for you or "pep up" old fuel. I hear that claim often. Not staying you're thinking that, just throwing it out there because, again, I don't know what you've been told in the past and I'm only running on clues here and throwing things out there that may be helpful to you.  Don't take things personal. People bring stuff for me to fix all the time and I can't do a thing until I know everything the bike has seen up until that point. I have upset people all the time that want to argue that they put fresh high octane fuel in their bike and therefore are convinced that it's the cure-all. They get mad at me for throwing away the expensive fuel they just bought, but then the bike runs better when I dump the water out of the tank and they go home with a healthy bike. So you can understand the correlations I made and why I asked the question and made the comment I did. 

Didn't initially want to write a novel on the topic, so that's why I don't asked one quick question and made one (possibly) helpful comment. Good luck on your bike. 

 

[cornerslider]

Just now, shinyribs said:

I thought you might have been told that you need to run high octane. I was just letting you know that Yamaha sent these bikes out to be run on 87, so it's not necessary. Do with that what you want as it was a secondary comment anyway.

Modern fuels go stale FAST. Stale fuel acts exactly at you explained. Ethanol is the most prevalent octane booster used these days. Pure gasoline can't even reach 87 octane without additives. The higher the octane the more additives that are required. Ethanol wants to separate from gasoline while simultaneously sucking water out of the air. 

 

Dumping fresh fuel on top of old fuel ( I have no idea how long your bike sat previously) won't rejuvenate the old stuff already in the tank. If the previous fuel was stale ( volatiles evaporated) or water laden due to ethanol, all you can do is drain it or burn it out.

 

Might be all you got going on. Or you got a bad batch of fuel this time. It happens. A lot. Especially with high octane fuels since most vehicles don't require it and it often sits in the station's tank longer, sometimes absorbing water all the white. Higher octane won't clean anything for you or "pep up" old fuel. I hear that claim often. Not staying you're thinking that, just throwing it out there because, again, I don't know what you've been told in the past and I'm only running on clues here and throwing things out there that may be helpful to you.  Don't take things personal. People bring stuff for me to fix all the time and I can't do a thing until I know everything the bike has seen up until that point. I have upset people all the time that want to argue that they put fresh high octane fuel in their bike and therefore are convinced that it's the cure-all. They get mad at me for throwing away the expensive fuel they just bought, but then the bike runs better when I dump the water out of the tank and they go home with a healthy bike. So you can understand the correlations I made and why I asked the question and made the comment I did. 

Didn't initially want to write a novel on the topic, so that's why I don't asked one quick question and made one (possibly) helpful comment. Good luck on your bike. 

 

VERY solid information here!!!! I got a "bad" tank of gas a few years ago. I knew it wasn't a good idea to buy fuel from a little convince store-  that was out in the middle of nowhere .... I was running out of fuel & options though . My bike barely ran, and required "maintenance throttle" to even idle. I had the foresight to run that tank until the fuel gauge started flashing. I topped it off with fuel from a reputable/high volume station, and haven't had a problem since.

That being said, I try to always run non-oxygenated/ethanol free fuel. Unfortunately, that usually means buying higher octane/premium fuel. When non-oxygenated fuel isn't available, I always go for the standard 87 octane, and my bike seems a bit "happier" with that choice.

I have many years of experience working in an oil refinery. Todays' standard of "quality fuel" is garbage compared to as little as 20 years ago . High-pressure EFI systems mask just how poor todays fuel is. My personal opinion is that ethanol increases profits for oil refineries- at the cost of being very hard on the fuel systems components. I used to have a station close to my home that had non-oxygenated/ethanol-free fuel available in 87 octane. That was ALWAYS my go-to station (they since went out of business). 

I know with my standard/stock compression in my "07", that 87 octane is the best choice. I also know that ethanol is terrible on fuel system components. I'd rather run higher octane ethanol-free fuel (and have my bike run slightly less than "optimal"), than deal with failing fuel system components. I've even gotten to the point that I run 93 octane ethanol/non-oxygenated in everything I own that has a carburetor (lawn mower, snowblower, weed-whip, leaf-blower), and haven't had any fuel related issues since doing so over a decade ago-

[Bsawyer]

Update:

Pulled the spark plugs out and changed them, tested the Gap and spark and they are working perfectly.

Pulled the tank off, drained all the gas out of it and put fresh (87) in the tank along with a dash of fuel injector cleaner.

Put it all back together and now the bike doesn't start at all. pulled the spark plugs out again keeping the tank still attached Line wise. and dumped a small amount of fuel into the cylinders. it'll fire off but wont run. after the initial dash of gas it will run for 1 second and then die and sounds like its not getting any fuel at all. doesn't even attempt to sputter or anything after or before putting gas in manually.

I'm not getting any error codes i can hear the fuel pump running while im attempting to start the bike. only thing i can think of now is i have bad fuel injector's. i dunno lol kinda lost atm

let me know your thoughts ty

[cornerslider]

The "07" platform doesn't have "true" fuel injectors.... I has a throttle-body, that is similar to a carburetor, but controlled electronically. Maybe check for a vacuum leak as @DewMan suggested??? Are you running the OEM ECU, or was it flashed/modified? In basic form, you need (3) things to get it to run-  Fuel, Air, and Spark. You have ruled out spark. That tells me me it's either air, or fuel.  The only other explanation,  would be that your valves are so far out of spec that the bike won't run- (I find that HIGHLY unlikely). My best guess is that it something as simple as a vacuum leak. There are two "ports" on the top of the intake boots (between the throttle bodies, and the head). They have very small rubber caps on them to plug them when they throttle bodies are in normal use (NOT being synchronized). They are held in place by  a small spring-clip that holds it in place.  If you were to lose one- (or both) of them,  it could explain what you are experiencing. I'm assuming the air filter is relatively fresh- based on a sudden loss of performance. Let us know what you get figured out -

[TMTYWSH]

On 9/16/2022 at 3:38 AM, shinyribs said:

I thought you might have been told that you need to run high octane. I was just letting you know that Yamaha sent these bikes out to be run on 87, so it's not necessary. Do with that what you want as it was a secondary comment anyway.

Modern fuels go stale FAST. Stale fuel acts exactly at you explained. Ethanol is the most prevalent octane booster used these days. Pure gasoline can't even reach 87 octane without additives. The higher the octane the more additives that are required. Ethanol wants to separate from gasoline while simultaneously sucking water out of the air. 

 

Dumping fresh fuel on top of old fuel ( I have no idea how long your bike sat previously) won't rejuvenate the old stuff already in the tank. If the previous fuel was stale ( volatiles evaporated) or water laden due to ethanol, all you can do is drain it or burn it out.

 

Might be all you got going on. Or you got a bad batch of fuel this time. It happens. A lot. Especially with high octane fuels since most vehicles don't require it and it often sits in the station's tank longer, sometimes absorbing water all the white. Higher octane won't clean anything for you or "pep up" old fuel. I hear that claim often. Not staying you're thinking that, just throwing it out there because, again, I don't know what you've been told in the past and I'm only running on clues here and throwing things out there that may be helpful to you.  Don't take things personal. People bring stuff for me to fix all the time and I can't do a thing until I know everything the bike has seen up until that point. I have upset people all the time that want to argue that they put fresh high octane fuel in their bike and therefore are convinced that it's the cure-all. They get mad at me for throwing away the expensive fuel they just bought, but then the bike runs better when I dump the water out of the tank and they go home with a healthy bike. So you can understand the correlations I made and why I asked the question and made the comment I did. 

Didn't initially want to write a novel on the topic, so that's why I don't asked one quick question and made one (possibly) helpful comment. Good luck on your bike. 

 

 

Does fuel stabilizer help (like STA-BIL) for winter storage, long term storage ?

[19MTMike]

Just now, TMTYWSH said:

 

Does fuel stabilizer help (like STA-BIL) for winter storage, long term storage ?

For a fuel stabilizer/treatment, I've had good luck with K100.  Available from Amazon and other sources.  Here's a link:  

Gas | Fuel Treatment and Gas Additive | Ethanol Treatment | Kinetic Fuel Technology Inc

   Hope this helps!

Mike

[Pursuvant]

Open the lid on the fuel tank with your spare key (because you can't remove key until it's closed).

My ears are crap, but I would get an ear down close to open lid and turn ignition to hot with my main key. I would think it would "resonate" like a drum, the fuel pump sound.

Listen - can you hear the fuel pump do anything unusual. Thinking it will pressurize injection system and then slow down to a stop clicking. There's a filter in there, is it scaled over?

Or not, just a guess

And I would want to know, if that fuel line connector under tank, has not been damaged by forcing it back together.

And there's that air pressure sensor on clinder 1 vacuum line (above throttle bodies) - might need to proof all it's connections for air leaks, and probably has a resistance "range" it works over. Is it reporting to ECU values that are not an error, but on the upper or lower end of the range (so it's not throwing codes but still a problem)

[cornerslider]

12 minutes ago, TMTYWSH said:

 

Does fuel stabilizer help (like STA-BIL) for winter storage, long term storage ?

It does.... I used to put that in everything I "stored". I live in MN, so that means anything with a motor gets stored at some point . Since I switched to non-ethenol/non-oxygenated fuel in every engine that isn't a car/truck, I haven't run "Sta-bil". I haven't had any fueling related issues. My personal opinion- Ethanol in todays fuel is the main problem. If you buy fuel from a high volume station, and run it in your car/truck- all is right with the world. If you attempt to use that same fuel in something that may "sit" for several months, you may regret that choice. I'm big fan of "Sta-bil", and I think it helps negate the effects of ethanol in todays fuel. I'm by no means an expert on fuels, I'm just sharing my experiences -

[Pursuvant]

Just now, cornerslider said:

It does.... I used to put that in everything I "stored". I live in MN, so that means anything with a motor gets stored at some point ">. Since I switched to non-ethenol/non-oxygenated fuel in every engine that isn't a car/truck, I haven't run "Sta-bil". I haven't had any fueling related issues. My personal opinion- Ethanol in todays fuel is the main problem. If you buy fuel from a high volume station, and run it in your car/truck- all is right with the world. If you attempt to use that same fuel in something that may "sit" for several months, you may regret that choice. I'm big fan of "Sta-bil", and I think it helps negate the effects of ethanol in todays fuel. I'm by no means an expert on fuels, I'm just sharing my experiences ">-

I'm going to remember that sage advice, thank you

[shinyribs]

15 hours ago, TMTYWSH said:

 

Does fuel stabilizer help (like STA-BIL) for winter storage, long term storage ?

Sorry, I can't comment on fuel stabilizer as I have no personal experience with it. But I've noticed that my two stroke fuel seemingly never goes bad, so I believe it entirely possible to add a component which keeps the fuel " together" longer.  I've had regular ethanol fuel mixed for two stroke use last two years with no special storage efforts at all.