Sheltered in place for 3 months = battery is dead.

[msb06c]

Battery has been well-used and well-maintained otherwise...

I got stuck quarantining away from my bike and it sat unused for 3 months, effectively making me a case of "didn't charge my bike all winter  and now my battery is dead." It's on a tender now and was charged about a week before being "abandoned." Can it bounce back? Should I bother getting lithium ion?  

 

Battery is YUASA YTZ10S which came from the Yam Dealer 

[Mr.Puss]

My tender got disconnected over a long winter. Tender would not pull it back from death. I could boost it to start but it would not hold a charge and would die as soon as I removed the cables, the battery's cells were toast. New battery, alls well. 

Even if you do pull it back why risk getting stuck somewhere with a questionable battery? Just buy a new one, theyre relatively inexpensive and you'll have piece of mind. My 2 cents.

[msb06c]

Yeah absolutely. Well I never did SAE bc street parking in NYC. Kinda hard to run power that way. But I also rode my bike daily commuting and joyriding so I’d only pull the battery and “top it off” for an hour every few months. 
 

I’m fairly sure I’ll just replace it next week. I have a big ride coming up and it’s just not worth it. 

[Mr.Puss]

41 minutes ago, msb06c said:

Yeah absolutely. Well I never did SAE bc street parking in NYC. Kinda hard to run power that way. But I also rode my bike daily commuting and joyriding so I’d only pull the battery and “top it off” for an hour every few months. 
 

I’m fairly sure I’ll just replace it next week. I have a big ride coming up and it’s just not worth it. 

Yeah damn, not being able to plug it in is unfortunate/inconvenient.

[gatrgof]

The LIPO battery is a bad deal for this bike and causes all the back compression problems like locking up the rear tire. Get a lead acid battery and be done with it. You cannot charge a LIPO battery with a normal battery tender as they are negative charge, doesn't work, and another reason to go to lead acid. You will find the bike performs much better with a lead acid battery. just remember to change the battery leads around, as negative is now positive. My bike is so much more fun since getting rid of that damn negative LIPO battery system, junk. Then do the fork mod(cut tubes 1/2" and go to 20 wt fork oil.) and your bike will be the unicorn.  The battery and fork job totally transformed my bike!!!!

please refrain from posting misleading or personal opinions that will confuse new riders as much as you have confused the rest of us, as well as the possibility of someone severely damaging their entire electrical system by following your advice

[DewMan]

2 hours ago, gatrgof said:

The LIPO battery is a bad deal for this bike and causes all the back compression problems like locking up the rear tire. Get a lead acid battery and be done with it. You cannot charge a LIPO battery with a normal battery tender as they are negative charge, doesn't work, and another reason to go to lead acid. You will find the bike performs much better with a lead acid battery. just remember to change the battery leads around, as negative is now positive. My bike is so much more fun since getting rid of that damn negative LIPO battery system, junk. Then do the fork mod(cut tubes 1/2" and go to 20 wt fork oil.) and your bike will be the unicorn.  The battery and fork job totally transformed my bike!!!!

How exactly does a different style of battery  cause "all the back compression problems like locking up the rear tire."

*grabs popcorn* 

[Mr.Puss]

3 hours ago, DewMan said:

How exactly does a different style of battery  cause "all the back compression problems like locking up the rear tire."

*grabs popcorn* 

This is a gooder to be sure. Popcorn? I'll need a bag full of model glue for this one to make sense.

[mossrider]

Wut? 

(Tips recliner back) log me in.

[klx678]

I'd call around and see if a dealer has a battery tester.  We had one from Honda when I was in a shop years back.   It can load test a battery and tell if it is any good.  If the dealership is one you use they may do the test and charge your battery for you for free if it is still good shape.  We did that for customers.   

Sure as heck don't see any problem with the YUASA YTZ10S since it is clearly suited as an OEM type and is simply the AGM style.   I will say if a battery is totally flat it usually will take a stronger charger than the battery tender.   If you have a car charger that will do 2 ah you can knock the power down a bit using a test light.  Here is the article from Cruiser.  click here   The YTZ10S is an 8.6 ah battery.

 

 

Maybe the back wheel locks up because the battery falls off the back fender where it is strapped, since it doesn't fit, and jams in between the tire and swing arm?  

Edited June 21, 2020 by klx678

[msb06c]

I swear this forum always brings out the best info and a few laughs.  Can’t beat it. 
 

Battery is still on tender and will pull it around lunch today and hope for the best. 
 

If it’s dead, obviously I’ll order a replacement this afternoon. However at $100 for a duplicate Yuasa ytz10s vs $150 for a lithium battery (antigravity or shorai).... small difference so I’m wondering: is there any reason NOT to upgrade to lithium? I don’t have a charger, so I’ll need one eventually, but aren’t I basically guaranteed a longer life? I am currently based in NYC but the bike will not be exposed to winter conditions for the next few years, so low temp isn’t a factor.  In fact it’ll be in a HOT climate. 

[gatrgof]

Well grab your popcorn and get ready! When the battery went dead I decided to go with a lead acid battery. I did not expect the changes that happened, but so glad they did. Rear wheel compression off throttle was dangerous in my opinion with the Lithium battery, especially a slick road, and in corners where gravel and dirt seem to congregate. The change has been very pleasant and I will not go back to the way it was before. If you change the battery to lead there are two ways to do it. First the posts will be on opposite sides in method one, and change the positive to the negative posts. Method two  just change the posts where they are on the frame. Follow the battery leads and swap them there. 

 

 

please refrain from posting misleading or personal opinions that will confuse new riders as much as you have confused the rest of us, as well as the high possibility of someone severely damaging their entire electrical system by following your advice

[mossrider]

2 hours ago, gatrgof said:

Well grab your popcorn and get ready! When the battery went dead I decided to go with a lead acid battery. I did not expect the changes that happened, but so glad they did. Rear wheel compression off throttle was dangerous in my opinion with the Lithium battery, especially a slick road, and in corners where gravel and dirt seem to congregate. The change has been very pleasant and I will not go back to the way it was before. If you change the battery to lead there are two ways to do it. First the posts will be on opposite sides in method one, and change the positive to the negative posts. Method two  just change the posts where they are on the frame. Follow the battery leads and swap them there. 

Better remain silent and let the world think you a fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt.

To the OP, either will serve you fine. Just wire them in accordance with modern conservative wisdom. 

[msb06c]

Just as an update to any future idiots coming here with a dead battery: my 0.75 Amp Battery Tender Junior did not have enough power to charge the dead battery. After being connected all night I was still reading under 4v 

 Currently I'm charging with a car battery charger. I'm hoping to determine if the battery is salvageable today, I should be charged up in a few hours time. 

...I'm not getting a Lithium Battery because of cost and potential weather issues. Will be replacing with AGM like OEM

[RobZilla]

To the OP, either battery is fine. Just wire it properly. It sounds like yours is toast and if it were mine I wouldn’t trust it again. If it had charged with the trickle charger I would have though.

[klx678]

Only problem and apparently very rare for the lithium is if it overheats and does a melt down.  Again very rare.

I still say look at the Cruiser article and use a car charger on the low setting using a diagnostic light as an additional load to cut down on the amp hours of the charge... if you can't take it to a shop that has a real battery tester.

[msb06c]

99% sure battery is toast at this point. Gonna let it charge this afternoon and put it back on a tender overnight.
 

If that fails, I either wait a week for amazon or find a Yuasa locally. 
 

what a bummer. I just wanna ride! 

[Devilman]

Leave the tender off, it will not charge a very low battery, it is a trickle charger with very low amps you could burn up the charger. Keep it on a car charger and the low amp setting after a few hours, raise the amps to normal, slowly recharge and hopefully should be fine. 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Devilman

[Devilman]

As for the Lithium battery causing back wheel to lock up, that should not happen because after it's started the Voltage Regulator (alternator) should be powering up everything and the battery is a back-up. If it's like a car you can disconnect the negative side after starting and it should still run.

[randy2100]

So, I guess the lack of lead weight was giving gatrgof problems.  Those LiPo batteries are just too light!

[gatrgof]

All I know is that as soon as the lead battery was installed the dangerous braking went away. If you install a lead battery you must change the connections around. The Lithium battery is a negative charge. I could not charge the lithium battery at all with a Junior trickle charge, but with the lead acid battery it is doing just fine now. 

 

please refrain from posting misleading or personal opinions that will confuse new riders as much as you have confused the rest of us, as well as the possibility of someone severely damaging their entire electrical system by following your advice

[mossrider]

Just now, gatrgof said:

All I know is that as soon as the lead battery was installed the dangerous braking went away. If you install a lead battery you must change the connections around. The Lithium battery is a negative charge. I could not charge the lithium battery at all with a Junior trickle charge, but with the lead acid battery it is doing just fine now. It is amazing all this vast knowledge from those who have never tried the lead acid battery to see if I am right! If you don't know, but talk as if you do, what is that? 

I don't dispute you observed some positive changes to your motorcycle for any number of reasons. I do however challenge your interpretation of those results.  To espouse wiring any 12 volt battery reverse polarity, in direct conflict to the manufacturers design, is rediculous. It flies in the face of science, physics and common sense. It's flat dangerous and gives an indication of your level of knowledge and understanding of the topic.  This motorcycle has always been delivered with a lead acid battery. If you changed to lead acid battery; someone, somewhere, at some time had chaged to what ever was in there. I cant speak to what or how that was done. Neither lead acid nor lithium ion (LiFePO4) battery require chaging the polarity of anything nor tampering with any factory wiring.  Either lead acid or LiFePO4 are perfectly acceptable replacements for this machine and are both wired directly using the standard factory connections in exactly the same fashion. They do charge in somewhat different fashion and affordable combination chargers are redily available.  This motorcycle could care less what the source of its required 12 volts DC is as long as it gets it. Lithium, nuclear, solar, lead acid or magic makes no difference.  Any anomalous rear wheel behavior that got corrected was not the result of a battery/polarity change. With further discussion we could undoubtedly discover a more probable cause of said improvement. 

Cheers,

Dave 

 

[LamHa]

8 hours ago, mossrider said:

I don't dispute you observed some positive changes to your motorcycle for any number of reasons. I do however challenge your interpretation of those results.  To espouse wiring any 12 volt battery reverse polarity, in direct conflict to the manufacturers design, is rediculous. It flies in the face of science, physics and common sense. It's flat dangerous and gives an indication of your level of knowledge and understanding of the topic.  This motorcycle has always been delivered with a lead acid battery. If you changed to lead acid battery; someone, somewhere, at some time had chaged to what ever was in there. I cant speak to what or how that was done. Neither lead acid nor lithium ion (LiFePO4) battery require chaging the polarity of anything nor tampering with any factory wiring.  Either lead acid or LiFePO4 are perfectly acceptable replacements for this machine and are both wired directly using the standard factory connections in exactly the same fashion. They do charge in somewhat different fashion and affordable combination chargers are redily available.  This motorcycle could care less what the source of its required 12 volts DC is as long as it gets it. Lithium, nuclear, solar, lead acid or magic makes no difference.  Any anomalous rear wheel behavior that got corrected was not the result of a battery/polarity change. With further discussion we could undoubtedly discover a more probable cause of said improvement. 

Cheers,

Dave 

 

gatrgof mentioned using LIPO in his very first post. Maybe he's ghetto rigging some RC toy battery to his bike? 

I'm running a lithium ion battery in my bike. Everything was conventional and no issues so far. 

[Beemer]

Battery drama.....

[msb06c]

So back to the idiot diary:

 

the battery was absolutely toast. Typically if AGM battery has fallen below 80% charge it’s time to start thinking about replacing. 
 

my battery would take a surface charge up to about 10v  but that would quickly drop back to a pitiful 4 volts. I was using an 8amp car charger which claimed an “8 amp charge and 2 amp maintence charge” and I had my battery on that for two (2) separate 3-4 hour sessions.  
 

I went and got another Yuasa (paid almost twice what it costs on amazon but hey) which at the store measured 12.9v.  It took a small 45 min trickle at 750 mah to read 13v. 
 

conclusion: 3 months is way, way too long to leave a motorcycle sitting. I think we all kinda knew that 

[gatrgof]

It is a Yuasa YTZ10S battery, and is a lead acid battery, my mistake there.

Here's the problem, the positive lead goes to the negative port on the battery, the forward post. The negative lead goes to the positive port on the battery. This is backwards on most batteries, and the manual will tell you most chargers will not work with this battery and will damage the battery. When I installed the new battery, I installed the red wire on the positive post and popped the fuse. So I switched the wires around and it solved the problem, negative wire(black) on the positive post. So the stock battery is very much different from a normal battery, and takes a special charger or you will ruin the battery. 

 

please refrain from posting misleading or personal opinions that will confuse new riders as much as you have confused the rest of us, as well as the possibility of someone severely damaging their entire electrical system by following your advice