Yamaha Tenere 700 vs KTM 790 Adv

[Beemer]

One persons comparison.

 

[FZ07R WaNaB]

Thanks Beemer - Interesting video

I will say that the reviewer is a serious non-committal mofo. My take on that review is that the KTM is the superior motorcycle. That's actually not surprising, but it doesn't take into account three major factors - reliability, cost, and the aftermarket.

First, my assumption is that the cost difference between the two will allow the T7 owner to get their bike to be as good as or better than the KTM. We have all seen that with our FZ/MT-07s.

Then the correlation between reliability and cost comes into play. KTM's are not known for their reliability but they are known for the cost to repair them.

Lastly, from what we have seen develop in the last several years with our bikes, the aftermarket for the T7 will explode which will make it all the easier to surpass the KTM. I'm sure 2WDW will have some fun with that one.

It's going to be an interesting battle on which one will really take off after the T7 makes it to the US.

 

Edited September 2, 2019 by FZ07R WaNaB

[shinyribs]

Naturally the 790 is more powerful with another 100cc's to sling around, but they're already having some of the typical issues KTM's seems to be plagued with from time to time. Oil leaks and foot pegs breaking are the two major ones that come to mind. And the peg issue is a big one. They screw in to the engine cases and fail when the lugs break off the engine. I mean, really? There's also clogged fuel filters and ill fitting air box connections which point directly at poor assembly quality. KTM has a reputation for letting leaky air boxes kill engines with ingested dirt, and it seems they're not trying hard to fix anything. 

More component issues include jammed gearboxes and faulty gauges. No joke.

Teething issues on new models is totally expected. But c'mon...this is 2019...oil leaks and foot pegs falling off should not even be a concern. Manufacturing technology in general is way beyond allowing any of that to be excusable. Jammed gearboxes?! I haven't heard of a bike unable shift past 2nd gear since...well, I've never heard of that!

 

I'm no Yamaha fanboy. I'll admit I'm pretty partial to Honda. But is the KTM a superior bike compared to the T7? In my eyes, it's not even close. The engine may be strong and the suspension may work well, but it's sounds like it has the build quality of a bad Chinese scooter. 

I love my CP2. Total horsepower figures aside, I think KTM has met it's rival with Yamaha. To me, Japanese bikes are premium motorcycles, with Honda and Yamaha sitting at the top of the podium. I grew up on KTM's. Love my Honda's and Yammies

[Beemer]

I would only think about taking any kind of large cc, heavy-ass adventure bike on fire roads where hopefully, if and when it goes down, you might actually have some somewhat solid surface beneath your feet to be able to pick it up. I've been on gravel roads and soft, talcum powder like dirt with my FZ-07 and there's no way in hell I'd want to even attempt to pick up any heavy adventure bike that's similar to an FZ-07 in size & weight on either surface. For newbs that don't know, your feet need traction to pick up a bike so it's something to consider when buying a bike. If I were going to just ride some street and trails close to home I would rather get just about any new 250cc street/trail bike. Argue over which one is best if you want but any of them will do the job, put a smile on your face and won't wear you out as much doing it. 

Bottom line and IMO, those bikes are made for long distance rides that involve a little easy off road riding and I'm sure they're "OK" for that but there's one big thing to consider that I haven't seen anyone mention in any article or video …. you have to factor in seat comfort on those long trips. I haven't seen any video where someone has ridden hundreds of miles to say whether the seat is good for it or not. I just see people saying, OH, it's comfortable after sitting on it for a few minutes. I wouldn't want to ride all day and develop a sore rump and then even think about riding on any rough stuff. Almost all of us have had trouble with seat comfort on our FZ's and MT's so I think that's a legit concern for either bike.

 

[shinyribs]

^Bingo on the weight. The ADV guys call anything under 500lbs light and their unicorn is a 400lb bike. 

The dirt bike guys cry foul if an OEM builds a bike weighing anywhere approaching 300lbs.  250-270 is common for a "heavy" 4 stroke.

Some of the newer 2 strokes are coming in right on the 200lb mark. 

I've ridden a 375lb KLR on tight single track and it's a workout. When you drop the bike you just sit and rest while it pukes fluids. I can't imagine doing it with another 75lbs+! 

 

[FZ07R WaNaB]

When in doubt, go for the compromise bike of the big three Japanese 650s - Suzuki DR650. ProCycle has all the gear to make that a bike you can easily go around the world with.

The reason I say compromise is two fold - weight and purpose.

The Honda XR650L is the better dirt bike. It is air cooled. It's the lightest at 346 lbs wet.

The Suzuki DR650 is an in between with dirt and street. It is air and oil cooled. It weighs 366 lbs wet.

The Kawasaki KLR650 is the better street bike. It is water cooled. It weighs a porky 432 lbs wet (sorry, Shinyribs, but that's what the Kawi website says).

Like everyone says, those big adventure bikes are a real problem if you wreck. Also, when you are riding in the dirt, you can easily notice the difference of 20-30 lbs, let alone 100-150 lbs. I think the T7 would be a great bike to ride on crappy paved roads or semi-decent jeep roads, but single track would be a handful. The 1200GS even more so. It's suppose to be fun after all.

 

Edited September 4, 2019 by FZ07R WaNaB

[shinyribs]

3 hours ago, FZ07R WaNaB said:

.

The Kawasaki KLR650 is the better street bike. It is water cooled. It weighs a porky 432 lbs wet (sorry, Shinyribs, but that's what the Kawi website says).

 

 

I modified mine before ever weighing it, so not sure what it was stock. Mine was 375 lbs with a full tank. I never thought I took that much weight off the bike, but who knows. Also, I think the Gen 2's with that bulky nose fairing thing are quite a bit heavier than the Gen 1's.  I flat out used and abused that bike daily for the year I owned it. Parked it outdoors and would have to chip the ice off the switches so I could start it. It was heavy, but unstoppable. I loved that bike, but don't miss it lol

 

 

[Beemer]

14 hours ago, FZ07R WaNaB said:

When in doubt, go for the compromise bike of the big three Japanese 650s - Suzuki DR650. ProCycle has all the gear to make that a bike you can easily go around the world with.

The reason I say compromise is two fold - weight and purpose.

The Honda XR650L is the better dirt bike. It is air cooled. It's the lightest at 346 lbs wet.

The Suzuki DR650 is an in between with dirt and street. It is air and oil cooled. It weighs 366 lbs wet.

The Kawasaki KLR650 is the better street bike. It is water cooled. It weighs a porky 432 lbs wet (sorry, Shinyribs, but that's what the Kawi website says).

Like everyone says, those big adventure bikes are a real problem if you wreck. Also, when you are riding in the dirt, you can easily notice the difference of 20-30 lbs, let alone 100-150 lbs. I think the T7 would be a great bike to ride on crappy paved roads or semi-decent jeep roads, but single track would be a handful. The 1200GS even more so. It's suppose to be fun after all.

 

I agree that the XR650L and the DR650 would be better bikes for the job, much better off road where it counts and if I had to choose a bike to have as a long distance adventure bike it would be the XR650L for it's lighter weight and greater suspension, 11.6 inches up front (T-7, 8.3 inches) to handle the 'real' off road bumps and at around 100 lbs. lighter than a T7. Which is going to handle better? It's a no brainer. Besides, it's been around forever for a reason, it's solid and it works. It also has a Baja 1000 WIN to back up any bike trash talk and make them eat it's dust as it's doing it, old tech or not.

[shinyribs]

Man, Beemer, don' get me started on old tech XL/XR bikes. I'll drag this thread so far off topic it'll end up on another forum altogether!

 

 

 

[Grant31781]

The T7 will be the better bike due to the reliability. While I like KTM for there light weight dirt bikes, They do have a lot of issues not seen in the Japanese bikes.

Either of these bikes for real offroad? No!  I ride county dirt roads on my WR250R. The T7 would do this too when it is dry. I rode after 3 inches of rain this week and almost dumped it in a big deep rutted mud puddle. I was dancing around on the pegs doing the twist and shout trying not to dump it. If I was on a T7,  I am sure I would have dumped it. No way my 140 pound self would have picked it up. On top of that, the road I was on was a grown up single lane road so it would have been difficult to ever turn around on a heavy bike.

 

The WR250R is happy to run 55 and 60 mph down dirt and pavement. Its also fun to blast around town on. It makes a 250 feel fast. Plus you get all kind of crazy looks. No one rides dual sports here so people are like what the heck.

[fzar]

7 hours ago, shinyribs said:

Man, Beemer, don' get me started on old tech XL/XR bikes. I'll drag this thread so far off topic it'll end up on another forum altogether!

 

 

 

Fantastic, very enjoyable to watch. Doing chores, and getting in touch with the natural surroundings Moto-Style. The way I see it, is you just did the most mundane thing I usually have to do and made it into something that I'd do just 1 letter at a time.

[shinyribs]

4 hours ago, fzar said:

Fantastic, very enjoyable to watch. Doing chores, and getting in touch with the natural surroundings Moto-Style. The way I see it, is you just did the most mundane thing I usually have to do and made it into something that I'd do just 1 letter at a time.

Haha, right on, man! I will drive right by a place I need to stop at on the way home in the work truck just so I can go back out as soon as I get home with one of the bikes. It's a sickness! And I don't want a cure. Drives my wife nuts, though. 

 

BTW, 10 points to anyone who spots the turkey

Edited September 5, 2019 by shinyribs

[Cruizin]

Guys, please feel free to visit and post on our tenere700.net forum as well. Its growing! 

@2wheeldynoworks has already begun tuning the T7, and is fixing the bad fueling on the T7 as well. 

[gregjet]

Well no real surprise. Disappointment but not surprise.The Yammy suspension sucks. Back wheel bouncing off the ground after landing. Slopping around at low speed. ie works nowhere. Unlike the 07 it isn't a cheap motorcycle. You are looking at over $20000 in Australia to get it and suspend it properly ( not here until christmas). That's without any other adventure mods.  I was seriously considering it until I saw the suspension performance. They could get away with the crap suspension on a $10000 bike, but not a $16000 for a few bits extra.

 KTM has really good suspension . Duh...white power, of course it is a quantum gap in quality. I would much prefer the yammy motor but the suspension just kills it.

[Beemer]

Just ran across this in case anyone is still interested.

 

[Jord]

On 9/4/2019 at 6:05 PM, shinyribs said:

Man, Beemer, don' get me started on old tech XL/XR bikes. I'll drag this thread so far off topic it'll end up on another forum altogether!

 

 

 

What a beautiful place you live 

[Mad]

My father has a tenere 700,  great bike , I really like how light it is to ride , seams lighter than a 07

With a decent "diet" it's  really offroad worthy. .. non of that 4000cc supermegahyper Enduro sh't 

I belive that the KTM is more of a street bike , but may be wrong. 

The only thing I'm allowed to make on his bike  is a top case support , the bracket that hold the case ....  but I'm making it cnc milled out of aluminum!

I was too hyped about working on the bike not to exaggerate 

[Beemer]

On 9/4/2019 at 1:05 PM, shinyribs said:

Man, Beemer, don' get me started on old tech XL/XR bikes. I'll drag this thread so far off topic it'll end up on another forum altogether!

 

 

 

lol! I somehow missed seeing that video back then but it was worth the wait. The bike looks/sounds good and you're lucky to have trails like that so close by. That's a big play ground in the winter. 

[shinyribs]

11 hours ago, Beemer said:

...you're lucky to have trails like that so close by. 

The trails part is actually my own land! haha  And I hate how that bike sounds TBH, but haven't taken the time to build a decent exhaust for it.

We have 100 acres here. Still cutting trails, but got a pretty decent loop going on. 

 

 

[Beemer]

11 hours ago, shinyribs said:

The trails part is actually my own land! haha  And I hate how that bike sounds TBH, but haven't taken the time to build a decent exhaust for it.

We have 100 acres here. Still cutting trails, but got a pretty decent loop going on. 

 

 

Well, I meant the engine, actually. I didn't want to say anything about the exhaust and come across as rude. I had a Super Trap on my XL500, it sounded pretty bad-ass, if you like raspy that is.

[shinyribs]

42 minutes ago, Beemer said:

Well, I meant the engine, actually. I didn't want to say anything about the exhaust and come across as rude. I had a Super Trap on my XL500, it sounded pretty bad-ass, if you like raspy that is.

Never seen/heard a Supertrap in the flesh. The way the outlet on them works worries me since I have saddlebags on that bike. Seems like it would just shoot the exhaust out 360 degrees around the outlet?

I actually love how my XR400 with a modified stock exhaust sounds. I may end up adapting one of those on to the XL.

 

 

[klx678]

On 12/11/2019 at 11:03 AM, Beemer said:

Just ran across this in case anyone is still interested.

 

 

 

That was great!   It's like buying the 700 Yamaha street bikes.  Sure there are faster, lighter, etc...   but the value!   That 700 is aces.  Nothing really better for remotely close to the price.   I could see that coming with the Tenere too.  That engine is incredibly strong.  Yamaha has hit three home runs here.  Is the KTM worth two to four grand more (ball park numbers)?   If you have the money to spend, maybe yes.  But you don't need to hang your head in shame owning any of Yamaha's 700 engine series motorcycles.   Fact is you can kind of grin, knowing what's still in the bank and how well your bargain basement buy actually is.

[Beemer]

People can always treat it how they treat the bargain FZ/MT07 and just take their time with mods to make it better. Besides, when the snobs aren't around, which is almost never, you only have one person to please and that's you. 

[klx678]

All I could think of what what the reaction would be if they put on a good shock and reworked forks for probably less than £800.   Plus the older cat kept saying a hell of a value for money spent.   I'd have no doubt suspension might put it right up there with the KTM and it seemed to deal with off road just fine when it came to engine power delivery.   

Either way, the video was really good, informative, classic, and funny.  More should be done like that.   

Part of why I bought the XSR was the Motorcyclist commute that Zack Courts did.  Clearly he liked the MT07 better for the price and style, but his reaction to the XSR told me a lot.  I'm not an MT07 kind of person for the style, I've never quite warmed up to the headlight styles and angular body work.  I liked the Triumph Speed Triple much more with the round headlights.   Just personal tastes and preferences.   My brother has an FJ09.  I am definitely sold on the 700 drive line.   After a few rides I could see how this engine would work aces in the Tenere package as well as the Tracer and MT.   

[shinyribs]

Regarding the price difference and the suspension differences.... I haven't ridden either, so I can't say if the KTM is vastly superior or not. But I will say that placebo effect is a real thing. 

The feel of luxury/quality can be subjective. One person can touch the switchgear of a Harley and comment on it's heft and it feels solid,well made and wonder why others cheap out with plastic switches. Another person can think the same switches feel overweight, bulky and wonder why they didn't spend more to design something slimmer. It's all in ones perspective sometimes. 

Is Yamaha's chassis really that inferior? Totally possible. Or does spending several thousand more on a bike that tackles the same terrain make you look for reasons to justify the difference? Who knows. 

Maybe the Yamaha needs the shock worked or replaced, but I bet the bike as a whole will be out getting the job done for a long time to come. 

People are still whining about how long it took the T7 to come to market, but that bike has been very well vetted. No blown rear shocks, leaking/broken engine cases, plugged fuel lines, locked transmissions, etc to worry about. And no host of electronics to fuss with ten years down the road, either. I value things like this more than I value the valving differences in stock suspensions.