How to Completely Removal of ABS System?

[RojoRacing]

I'm asking here in the racing subforum because racers are more likely to do this whereas normal riders are over there trying to figure out how to add abs 

On the newer MT models it seems abs is standard, so what goes into removing everything abs related?  Sorry if I sound a little old school but I come from a time before abs, traction control and slipper clutches so I'm not a big fan of a bunch of extra tubes and hoses.  I've done my best searching around for a thread on the subject but I'm coming up empty.  I should add that this isn't for a track bike but for my daily commuter so I'd like to avoid any problematic dash warning lights if possible. 

 

thanks

 

Edited November 3, 2018 by RojoRacing

[Mad]

If you can stand the orange light you could just remove the abs fuse ... you can store it in the same box and be able to reuse it if you change mind .

 

[RojoRacing]

I was aware of the fuse hack as it was the only info I was able to dig up.  If all the orange light does is be orange and doesn't put the bike in some kind of limp mode  then I'm cool with that since orange is my favorite color.  All that is going to do is disable the system which if it's still physically still on the bike I don't care if it's active or not.  What I'm asking is what goes into removing all the parts from the bike for a cleaning look and easier maintenance later down the line, weight reduction is a mute point once I figure out how I'm going to mount my mountain bike to the rear. 

I've never ridden a moto with abs I'm actually going to purchase an Mt-07 in the next few weeks to replace my blown up ninja with 120,000 miles on it.   If abs on the MT acts anything like it does in almost every car or truck I've driven then I'm sure I'll be removing the fuse in the first weeks because ABS is a serious hazard for those who have excellent feel under hard braking. 

[shinyribs]

I'm not sure how all the brake lines are routed through the ABS module, but you'll most likely just end up yanking all those lines off and running new lines from the master cylinders directly to the calipers. 

[RojoRacing]

1 hour ago, shinyribs said:

I'm not sure how all the brake lines are routed through the ABS module, but you'll most likely just end up yanking all those lines off and running new lines from the master cylinders directly to the calipers. 

This is what I was expecting and if it means the need for some stainless or Kevlar lines for a direct run between the master and caliper then it would kill two birds with one stone.  I was just curious if it was actually that simple or if their are other things in the system that need to be changed on a factory equipped abs bike. 

[AlbatrossCafe]

ABS in motorcycles has come a long way. In early iterations, it was almost more dangerous in some situations to have ABS (counter-intuitive) because of how it modulated the brakes and caused jerky movements.

 

Nowadays, it is 1000% more smooth and refined. I just rode an FJ09 with ABS the other day. For kicks, I slammed on the both breaks as hard as I can. Braking was easily controlled and I noticed no jerking like you do in a car. I would try it out first before you discount it so quickly.

[blackout]

6 hours ago, shinyribs said:

I'm not sure how all the brake lines are routed through the ABS module, but you'll most likely just end up yanking all those lines off and running new lines from the master cylinders directly to the calipers. 

That's what I figured as well.  

[RojoRacing]

7 hours ago, AlbatrossCafe said:

ABS in motorcycles has come a long way. In early iterations, it was almost more dangerous in some situations to have ABS (counter-intuitive) because of how it modulated the brakes and caused jerky movements.

 

Nowadays, it is 1000% more smooth and refined. I just rode an FJ09 with ABS the other day. For kicks, I slammed on the both breaks as hard as I can. Braking was easily controlled and I noticed no jerking like you do in a car. I would try it out first before you discount it so quickly.

Not discounting it and in fact I'll surely give it a good test so I can recommend or not recommend it to others but for someone like myself even if it works perfectly it's not really gaining me anything I can't already do.  That's why I want to remove it to simplify the componentry or the bike. 

I hope it's as good as some of you claim because god knows I see a lot of street riders who could benefit from ABS when they panic brake.  For professional racers with their muscle memory it's just not a necessity. 

[enduro250]

On 11/4/2018 at 5:35 AM, shinyribs said:

I'm not sure how all the brake lines are routed through the ABS module, but you'll most likely just end up yanking all those lines off and running new lines from the master cylinders directly to the calipers. 

yes, so have done as well

[faffi]

I used to have the same idea as you, Rojo, because 20+ years ago when ABS first began to become somewhat common on motorcycles, they could not match a good rider. That is, if that same rider didn't panic or hit an oil slick or similar, when the ABS even then could mean the difference between staying upright or going down. 

 

In addition to the more often than not mediocre performance of the ABS of the era, I was also little excited about the added weight and complexity. Today, especially after a year with the MT07, I have changed my mind.

 

The ABS on the MT07 is very good. It will not interfere even if the rear wheel is lifted off the ground as long as there is sufficient grip. If grip is abysmal, ABS will help the wheels rolling. It will even save your bacon during cornering, at least up to 35 degrees of lean slamming on the brakes will prevent a lock-up.

 

One thing to remember is that no matter how good you are, and how excellent your reflexes are, there are times when ABS will beat you. Especially when grip vary over a given stopping distance. Or if grip is much worse than anticipated - the less grip, the more even an eggspert will have to practice to find the absolute limit. And even with practice, virtually nobody can beat the best ABS systems available.

 

Personally, I regularly practice locking up the front wheel, just to keep my reflexes intact*. However, my reflexes goes no further than releasing the brake fully to regain control - you may be able to just reduce the lever pressure enough to get the wheel rolling again to prevent free-rolling and the subsequent increase in braking distance. I would not bet on being able to do that if an elk jumped out right in front of you without warning, but then again you may be that good. I'm definitely not.

 

*Yesterday, I was doing some hard practice stops with my old Deauville on an old road with different patches of asphalt. One piece turned out to be very slippery and the front wheel locked early and unexpectedly. I was saved by my practices, but if I really had to come to a stop, ABS would have helped a lot. 

 

[RojoRacing]

Still reserving judgment since it's only been 2 days but already had the front ABS trip on me when coming to a stop light several times.  At this point it's more of an annoyance then a danger since I'm not even at risk of sliding the front tire, it's just freaking out from some very minor changes in the road surface. The annoying part is each time it has caused me to over shoot my intended stopping point but a couple feet like stopping mid crosswalk instead of just before the line.  

 

I still need to play around with the rear but it's hard because as a racer my rear tire was always off the ground or nearly so when braking so there was little need for rear brakes. 

[Beemer]

On ‎11‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 11:16 PM, RojoRacing said:

Still reserving judgment since it's only been 2 days but already had the front ABS trip on me when coming to a stop light several times.  At this point it's more of an annoyance then a danger since I'm not even at risk of sliding the front tire, it's just freaking out from some very minor changes in the road surface. The annoying part is each time it has caused me to over shoot my intended stopping point but a couple feet like stopping mid crosswalk instead of just before the line.  

 

I still need to play around with the rear but it's hard because as a racer my rear tire was always off the ground or nearly so when braking so there was little need for rear brakes. 

Are the FZ/MT's front brakes good enough they can do the same thing consistently, like on the race bike? If not, what rotors/pads would you recommend as better brakes on the street for this bike? Mine seem pretty good from the factory but they don't seem high performance. Any thoughts on that just yet?

[RojoRacing]

12 hours ago, Beemer said:

Are the FZ/MT's front brakes good enough they can do the same thing consistently, like on the race bike? If not, what rotors/pads would you recommend as better brakes on the street for this bike? Mine seem pretty good from the factory but they don't seem high performance. Any thoughts on that just yet?

Braking power is very subjective. Any modern sport bike with dual rotors has enough power to lock the front wheel, float the rear and even toss you over the front. The only limit is how hard you want to pull the lever and how it’s going to feel in your fingers. I can’t expect someone to understand the extent of what I mean when I say brakes feel vague unless that person has used a pair of $30,000 world super bike spec Brembos.  If you do get the chance to try such a setup on track I suggest you refuse unless you want every other bike in the future to feel vague. 

 

The brakes on the MT have enough power to get you stopped in any situation if you just pull the lever hard enough. Different pads will give them a sharper initial bite which with rubber lines could make it feel stronger but even more vague.  Steel brake lines will make the whole range of braking power from initial to full hard spot feel more linear like your controlling the brakes yourself instead of asking someone else for more pressure. A radial master cylinders(your brake lever system) will complete change the feel of the brakes and get you the greatest improvement overall. Tossing on the stock Brembo master off any crashed 600 or 1000cc sport bike will be a great improvement. 

 

Back in in the day Chuck Graves suggested I go back to stock Yamaha pads in the R1 and R6 race bikes. I was surprised how well they work compared to so many racing pads and somehow they just lasted longer as well, go figure. 

[no-lag]

i would remove all the ABS stuff including all the lines.

 

make new lines.

 

ECU Flash

 

= Done

[blackout]

Watching a Bike World shootout on YouTube, it sounds like a lot of the top liter bikes have an ABS system that will activate too early on the track in the hands of an advanced rider....

[RojoRacing]

Yeah I’ve given the abs on this bike a chance but it has trigger on me where it’s not needed often enough that I’m now needlessly wary of what surfaces I’m going to ending my braking zone on.  Having to plan to avoid abs activation is not something I want to have to do on my bike. It’s bad enough I have to overbrake into a corner in my truck and accelerate through the corners to prevent stability control from slamming on my front brakes, my fun vehicle should be free of such burdens. 

 

Once I figure out  handlebar setup I’ll be sourcing some custom brake lines and removing the whole abs system. 

[RojoRacing]

Now that I’m more comfortable on how the bike rides I’m starting to dislike the lack of pure bite on the stock brakes. It can stop pretty hard but I find I’m having to pull the level hard then I’d like to do so. 

[NikitaUCLA]

This is funny. I on the other hand wants ABS on my FZ07 but don't have that option.

[sorkyah]

On 11/19/2018 at 11:02 PM, RojoRacing said:

Yeah I’ve given the abs on this bike a chance but it has trigger on me where it’s not needed often enough that I’m now needlessly wary of what surfaces I’m going to ending my braking zone on.  Having to plan to avoid abs activation is not something I want to have to do on my bike. It’s bad enough I have to overbrake into a corner in my truck and accelerate through the corners to prevent stability control from slamming on my front brakes, my fun vehicle should be free of such burdens. 

 

Once I figure out  handlebar setup I’ll be sourcing some custom brake lines and removing the whole abs system. 

If you're going to remove the system, I'll take it off your hands

As for bars, most grab either the rental ultralow or the woodcraft clipon adapter

I've gone with the Gilles gtol myself

 

[pegasus46]

I am sure curious how you can brake better than MM & VR because their bikes have ABS.

[stickshift]

On 4/3/2019 at 12:45 PM, pegasus46 said:

I am sure curious how you can brake better than MM & VR because their bikes have ABS.

MotoGP does not use ABS. Top level racers can brake more effectively without ABS systems...

[DewMan]

ABS is not for racers who've spent many 100s of hours learning the limits of their bikes ridden on tracks free of debris, barring the occasional oil spill from a crash. ABS is for people who ride on the streets that aren't manicured for motorcycle use or dealing with cagers that you're invisible to.

That's my opinion.. but I've been wrong before.

[phyciocc]

ABS is for those time when you are going your way, minding your business and a doofus in a BMW yakking on the phone cuts you off.  You grab all the brakes you can, and the tires will NOT lock up.  You can still steer.  Racing is a different story.  I too would like ABS.  Is there any way to add it to a 2015 FZ07?

Marco

[Beemer]

1 hour ago, phyciocc said:

ABS is for those time when you are going your way, minding your business and a doofus in a BMW yakking on the phone cuts you off.  You grab all the brakes you can, and the tires will NOT lock up.  You can still steer.  Racing is a different story.  I too would like ABS.  Is there any way to add it to a 2015 FZ07?

Marco

I just copied this from an article: "We also note that aftermarket fitting of ABS for motorcycles is a complex process that requires third party engineering certification, so ABS fitment is very difficult for anyone other than the vehicle manufacturer and is best left to them."  -  

Irresponsible advice on motorcycle ABS - Motorbike Writer

---

A VicRoads brochure has given the wrong impression of ABS (anti-lock brake systems) and even offered advice that riders fit an...

 

[phyciocc]

Well, so much for that.  I think I knew it at one time but hey, at my age I get forgetful.  So, is this a good enough excuse to get a new bike?  "But Honey,  it has ABS..."