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captainkool4

Removing 02 sensor on stock exhaust?

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captainkool4

Hey,

 

I got a flash by 2wdw and they suggested I remove my snorkel and o2 sensor.  Is it as simple as disconnecting the sensor from the bike and putting it away?  Do I have to plug the hole it will leave behind on my exhaust?  

 

Also, for the snorkel, any tips?  Should I take out only the snorkel piece and leave the flat plate?

 

Thanks a lot guys, pretty new to this and don't wanna screw it up.

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norcal616

remove the stock o2 sensor... thread size 12mm x 1.25mm... tuck the harness wire away... snorkle is removed, one screw is holding it down IIRC

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DewMan
1 hour ago, norcal616 said:

remove the stock o2 sensor... thread size 12mm x 1.25mm... tuck the harness wire away... snorkle is removed, one screw is holding it down IIRC 

I don't believe there is any screw holding the snorkel. It is held in strictly by the U shaped flange that holds it to the cover plate. You may be thinking of the single screw that holds down the filter? ✌️

 

@captainkool4, I'd drop an email to 2WDWs and get their opinion as to whether to pull the complete lid or just the snorkel.  As for my 2WDW flash, I left the lid on but pulled out the snorkel. Congrats on the flash... I'm guessing you'll really like it. 👍

 

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FZ07R WaNaB
8 hours ago, captainkool4 said:

they suggested I remove my snorkel and o2 sensor

This is a first for me. I've never heard of removing the O2 sensor. 2WDW surely didn't tell me to do that with my flash. I thought that causes all kind of problems.

 

What's anyone think about this?  Ideally if 2WDW sees this, please let us know.

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captainkool4
12 hours ago, norcal616 said:

remove the stock o2 sensor... thread size 12mm x 1.25mm... tuck the harness wire away... snorkle is removed, one screw is holding it down IIRC

Are you saying to thread in a new Bolt where the sensor used to sit?

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norcal616
18 minutes ago, captainkool4 said:

Are you saying to thread in a new Bolt where the sensor used to sit?

yes

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mjh937

2WDW told me to remove the snorkel but leave the lid on.  You can just remove the seat and reach in to remove the snorkel, it is not attached with screws.  I did not think to ask about the O2 sensor but I have had no issues with it connected. 

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gregjet

There are O2 sensor plugs available on the net. I use a stainless bolt and machined it down and added a hollow down the middle like the ones Akra supply. Bolt cost me 80c, but I do have a lathe.

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FZ07R WaNaB
4 hours ago, mjh937 said:

I did not think to ask about the O2 sensor but I have had no issues with it connected. 

My bike has the stock exhaust with the snorkel removed, 2WDW flash and a MWR air filter, plus the O2 sensor is attached.

 

My FZ runs so good as is, I'm scared to remove the O2 sensor. Like they say... "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"

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captainkool4

So do any of you run without an 02 sensor?  What's your experience?

Edited by captainkool4

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Cruizin

Hey, can someone help this guy? 

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DewMan

I've not heard of anyone running without some sort of O2 sensor either stock or an aftermarket wideband.  Not sure how the ECU can do it's job with out input data to work from. But then I'm not an ECU guru nor do I pretend to be.

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poida

I'm currently running without a o2 sensor. 

 

My Ecu was tuned by 'TuneBoy' here in Sydney. 

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DewMan
35 minutes ago, poida said:

I'm currently running without a o2 sensor. 

 

My Ecu was tuned by 'TuneBoy' here in Sydney. 

I'm curious to know what is gained by running without the data from an O2 sensor.

Learning is half the battle.  😀👍

Edited by DewMan
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stickshift

I'm running without stock O2 sensor. I have a Power Commander fitted, it includes an O2 sensor 'eliminator'.

 

The standard (narrow band) O2 sensor only operates in closed-loop mode, controlling fuelling in cruise and steady throttle applications. Traditionally this mode would target a stoichiometric air:fuel mixture (14.7:1). Today's tighter regs lead to manufacturers leaning this out further, which can help fuel economy but hinder performance. Other fuelling values (such as wide open throttle) are set directly in the ecu, and can be changed via aftermarket software etc.

 

Wide band O2 sensors are used in 'active tune' and other applications. These can tailor fuel values for all throttle settings on the fly taking into account changing parameters of other sensors (throttle opening, speed, air temp, air pressure etc).

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DewMan
10 minutes ago, stickshift said:

I'm running without stock O2 sensor. I have a Power Commander fitted, it includes an O2 sensor 'eliminator'.

 

The standard (narrow band) O2 sensor only operates in closed-loop mode, controlling fuelling in cruise and steady throttle applications. Traditionally this mode would target a stoichiometric air:fuel mixture (14.7:1). Today's tighter regs lead to manufacturers leaning this out further, which can help fuel economy but hinder performance. Other fuelling values (such as wide open throttle) are set directly in the ecu, and can be changed via aftermarket software etc.

  

Wide band O2 sensors are used in 'active tune' and other applications. These can tailor fuel values for all throttle settings on the fly taking into account changing parameters of other sensors (throttle opening, speed, air temp, air pressure etc).

So is the Power Commander sending faked O2 sensor data to the ECU to fool it into running a particular way?

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poida
1 hour ago, DewMan said:

I'm curious to know what is gained by running without the data from an O2 sensor.

Learning is half the battle.  😀👍

Ok, i'm no expert but from my understanding the o2 sensor is basically for the 0-20% throttle position (closed loop). Above 20% throttle the fuel trims are read from the map in the ECU. 0-20% in my case was very lean, see the video, AFR is over ~16. So without the o2 sensor, the flashed ECU will read trim values (based from the dyno tune) for the 0-20% throttle region.

You can watch 'TuneBoy' tune my bike on this youtube video, Wayne is basically tuning the 0-20% region:

 

 

Edited by poida
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stickshift
1 hour ago, DewMan said:

So is the Power Commander sending faked O2 sensor data to the ECU to fool it into running a particular way?

It removes the closed loop fuelling function altogether. Fuelling is solely based on the values in the fuel table (the timing table values are also optimised).

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Beemer

If it's like my EJK the flash tune 'over rides' the sensor from idle speed on up so the sensor doesn't affect the bike when left in place. You shouldn't have to disconnect it and plug the hole unless it works totally different, which I'm not sure of. Call the guys at 2wheeldynoworks to confirm.

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CarGuy7a

I'm not sure how 2wdw's software for ECU tuning on the FZ07 is but I have seen videos of guys tuning 4 cyl bikes with the FTECU setup and it gives an option in the software to disable the stock O2 sensor. Not sure if it gives that option on the FZ07 you'd have to call and ask them if that's what they did. If they did, then it's not really a problem. Remove the O2, plug the bung and ride on.

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captainkool4

Just an update. I've ridden a few days with the 02 sensor disconnected and I've noticed less jerk from the throttle, it has less of a violent on/off character.  I'm really digging it!

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FZ07R WaNaB
2 hours ago, captainkool4 said:

Just an update. I've ridden a few days with the 02 sensor disconnected and I've noticed less jerk from the throttle, it has less of a violent on/off character. 

So I am curious, did you ride your bike with the flash AND with the sensor connected, before you disconnected the sensor? If so, how many miles did you ride with the flash and the sensor connected?

 

The reason I am asking is that my bike has the sensor connected with the 2WDW flash plus the R6 throttle tube, and the throttle is not jerky at all, especially compared to the way it was stock. If you had enough time with the flash and the sensor connected to make a real comparison between connected and disconnected and you still noticed a difference, that gets me very interested. If you didn't ride much with it connected, then all you are noticing is the regular effect of the flash.

 

I'll give Nels a call and see what he suggests regarding the sensor. Depending who you talk to there, I have gotten different answers - I trust Nels the most.

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captainkool4
13 minutes ago, FZ07R WaNaB said:

So I am curious, did you ride your bike with the flash AND with the sensor connected, before you disconnected the sensor? If so, how many miles did you ride with the flash and the sensor connected?

 

The reason I am asking is that my bike has the sensor connected with the 2WDW flash plus the R6 throttle tube, and the throttle is not jerky at all, especially compared to the way it was stock. If you had enough time with the flash and the sensor connected to make a real comparison between connected and disconnected and you still noticed a difference, that gets me very interested. If you didn't ride much with it connected, then all you are noticing is the regular effect of the flash.

 

I'll give Nels a call and see what he suggests regarding the sensor. Depending who you talk to there, I have gotten different answers - I trust Nels the most.

Yeah I rode it with the flash and sensor connected for maybe 50 miles and was pretty dissatisfied with the jerkiness.  So much that I sent the ecu back for them to check it out.  

 

They checked it out and said there were no errors, and they recommended I remove the 02 sensor. 

 

When I got it back, I tried it with the 02 sensor for one ride and it still seemed pretty jerky, but I wasn't being too scientific about my observations.  Then I disconnected the sensor and I feel like the harshness of the jerkiness is satisfactorily reduced.

 

I'd be curious what they tell you about the sensor.

Edited by captainkool4

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FZ07R WaNaB
1 hour ago, captainkool4 said:

I'd be curious what they tell you about the sensor.

Me too, as my power delivery is amazingly smooth.

 

One of the things that I wonder is how often they tweak the mapping for the FZ for a specific application. I wonder if the flash for my ECU setup for stock exhaust with the baffle out has changed any since I got it flashed in 2016. If so, would it make sense to send it back for an updated flash.

 

2WDW, you listening?

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Randucci

Since I live close to 2WDW, I rode there a few weeks ago and got a flash. They pulled out the snorkel at that time. They did not say anything about disconnecting the O2 Sensor. I am going to install a Akra exhaust, so I’ll ask them when I get the reflash for the added exhaust.

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