CBR600RR shock without airbox clearance issues

[fjcruise]

My '05 shock has a Schrader valve. I have a zero loss nitrogen set up already(have it for my Landcruiser coil over shocks).

[fzar]

On 8/30/2017 at 10:54 PM, shinyribs said:

For personal reasons, I wasn't willing to ditch the factory airbox.

Are you willing to divulge into why you didn't want to ditch the stock airbox? @shinyribs

 

Edited December 10, 2018 by fzar

[shinyribs]

5 minutes ago, fzar said:

Are you willing to divulge into why you don't want to ditch the stock airbox?

 

Certainly. I've owned bikes with exposed filter elements ( pods, like the Hordpower setup uses) and I grew to hate it. Riding year round in all types of weather, and living around a lot of dirt/gravel roads gave me lots issues. Other than constantly filthy filters ( how much power could they be adding at that point, and how safe is my engine breathing?) soaked with either dirt, rain, road grime,etc...the biggest annoyance was crosswinds. A strong crosswind, or sometimes just a passing semi, would often create enough turbulence around the bikes that I was basically left powerless. Like the engine couldn't breathe at all, sometimes unable to keep up with traffic. I finally stuck my stock airboxes back on and realized that not was I giving a ton of part throttle power and throttle response, but life for the bike just became easier in general. 

 

 

No slam against the Hordpower pods at all. I'm sure they make the power they say they do. And I never rode my FZ07 with open elements to say just how the bike would react, but I'd had enough experience to know that I wasn't a fan of exposed filters. 

 

Really sucks when you get home and discover you lost one, or one developed a tear, and you wonder what exactly your bike has been swallowing recently. 

[fzar]

On 12/9/2018 at 6:28 PM, shinyribs said:

Certainly. I've owned bikes with exposed filter elements ( pods, like the Hordpower setup uses) and I grew to hate it. Riding year round in all types of weather, and living around a lot of dirt/gravel roads gave me lots issues. Other than constantly filthy filters ( how much power could they be adding at that point, and how safe is my engine breathing?) soaked with either dirt, rain, road grime,etc...the biggest annoyance was crosswinds. A strong crosswind, or sometimes just a passing semi, would often create enough turbulence around the bikes that I was basically left powerless. Like the engine couldn't breathe at all, sometimes unable to keep up with traffic. I finally stuck my stock airboxes back on and realized that not was I giving a ton of part throttle power and throttle response, but life for the bike just became easier in general. 

 

 

No slam against the Hordpower pods at all. I'm sure they make the power they say they do. And I never rode my FZ07 with open elements to say just how the bike would react, but I'd had enough experience to know that I wasn't a fan of exposed filters. 

 

Really sucks when you get home and discover you lost one, or one developed a tear, and you wonder what exactly your bike has been swallowing recently. 

Thanks for answering @shinyribs I really never thought about it in that manner. I live around a lot of dirt roads and an area that has been marked for development (factories + housing for said factories) I have the snorkel off mine and its not a big deal, but man if I had pods and stopped to get gas or whatever and saw 1 missing I'd be pissed.

 

That some nice work your doing with the shock and reservoir, clean stuff. I'm thinking about just getting the shock and having an oogle at it to see if I have the capabilities and/or the tools to take it on myself. I'm probably going to just buy it and stop procrastinating and get stuck in, at worst I lose $30-$60 on the shock and have a nugget to throw into the bag of experience.Then I could bring it to some suspension shop and get it rebuilt. I'm not entirely sure I could get the same setup as yours or even similar, but if I could it seems like the better option while leaving the stock air-box in situ.

[shinyribs]

@fzar  If you don't mind me asking where you are located, I'm in Bedford, Virginia. I'd be happy to help you out with a shock swap. 

 

A decent no-frills nitrogen charging station will run you about $250, so if you are tooling up for this one job you start to approach the price of aftermarket shocks. But I love working on suspension ( dirt bikes always need something), so having the charging station works out good for me. 

 

I've got a new method for making reservoir mounts now that is much cleaner. I might remake mine when I'm done with my current build. This is before final finishing. 

Edited December 11, 2018 by shinyribs

[faffi]

Cool CB-project, shinyribs! Was the 1100 called Super Sport at your market, or is it something you have kept from the 750 that I presume you got the paint scheme off?

 

 

[fzar]

16 hours ago, shinyribs said:

If you don't mind me asking where you are located, I'm in Bedford, Virginia. I'd be happy to help you out with a shock swap. 

 

A decent no-frills nitrogen charging station will run you about $250, so if you are tooling up for this one job you start to approach the price of aftermarket shocks. But I love working on suspension ( dirt bikes always need something), so having the charging station works out good for me. 

 

I've got a new method for making reservoir mounts now that is much cleaner. I might remake mine when I'm done with my current build. This is before final finishing. 

Thanks for offering your help @shinyribs, I'm in Bentonville, Arkansas so that's a geographical handicap. Thanks anyway.

 

I understand your point about tooling up for a 1-timer would be closing in on a out of the box upgrade, so I might see if I can find a shop that'll do it for me. (as much as I hate saying those words). Nice job on the mounts, the CB project looks like it's fun.

[shinyribs]

16 hours ago, faffi said:

Cool CB-project, shinyribs! Was the 1100 called Super Sport at your market, or is it something you have kept from the 750 that I presume you got the paint scheme off?

 

 

We only got the 1100 in '83 and it was called a CB1100F Super Sport, which seems really weird to me coming from the world of Chevrolet lol. The blue silver paint scheme is a Freddie Spencer nod as those were the colors he used. We never got got that color here. Not sure anyone did from Honda, actually. The 1100 striping was totally different here, so these are 750/900 stripes. 

 

It's a big ol' bus, but I've managed 72lbs off the old girl so far. Trying to hit 475 with a full tank, but I'm a bit off that target right now. 555 wet was the stock weight. Big girls need love, too! 

 

 

@fzar if you run in to dead ends with local shops give me a shout. We might not be close, but I won't leave you hanging.  Rebuilding the shock is deadly simple. I'm confident you'd have no issues there, so at most have to get a shop to just fill the nitrogen charge when you're done. Everyone I talked to online could get that done for cheap, like $10-20. But I live in BFE and there's only one bike shop around here. That want $125 to rebuild a shock, but that still charge $125 just to fill one! Pissed me off so I set up a filling station of my own lol.

Edited December 12, 2018 by shinyribs

[faffi]

The wet weight for the naked version was actually 263 kg, or 579 lb, so it was indeed heavy. I owned one sold as a new model in 1985 (but was old stock tarted up and sold cheap in Norway that year). It came with the fairing off the CBX400/550F2 as well as an underbelly pan. You can see how it looked in this ad https://www.finn.no/mc/all/ad.html?finnkode=134561992

 

What I remember most is the harsh vibrations from the engine and the absolutely unflappable stability. Scraping pegs around bumpy 200kph/125mph corners didn't faze it in the least.

 

Sorry for the high-jack, I'll stop now 

[Gabe]

Has anybody else tried this? Because I think I'm going to.

[cemsicles]

On 1/30/2018 at 1:08 PM, shinyribs said:

Sorry for not answering earlier. I just saw your question. Yes, I did have to make shims to bolt the shock in. 

This was awhile back, but I was wondering if you happened to write down or remember roughly what size shims you used? I am not much of a fabricator, so I will get bunch of different sizes probably.

[shinyribs]

On 5/20/2020 at 11:27 AM, cemsicles said:

This was awhile back, but I was wondering if you happened to write down or remember roughly what size shims you used? I am not much of a fabricator, so I will get bunch of different sizes probably.

All you really need us a handful of different thickness washers. I think those are 12mm bolts. 

 

The most important thing is do not pinch the shock mount that's made in to the engine cases. It will break off if pinched! 

There's a floating thing in the engine cases that makes bolting in the shock possible. It makes perfect sense when you it. Just make sure you are tightening against that and not pulling the two cast aluminum ears of the shock mount together. Cast aluminum is strong, but it won't flex like that. A couple washers to recreate the width of the original shock it's all you need. 

[cemsicles]

4 hours ago, shinyribs said:

All you really need us a handful of different thickness washers. I think those are 12mm bolts. 

 

The most important thing is do not pinch the shock mount that's made in to the engine cases. It will break off if pinched! 

There's a floating thing in the engine cases that makes bolting in the shock possible. It makes perfect sense when you it. Just make sure you are tightening against that and not pulling the two cast aluminum ears of the shock mount together. Cast aluminum is strong, but it won't flex like that. A couple washers to recreate the width of the original shock it's all you need. 

That's awesome info, thank you. This is exactly why I asked as I have seen a few people who had to weld after getting a crack. I am planning to measure the spaces and make sure when all said and done it remains exactly the same after everything is bolted together.

Just completely overhauled my front suspension with preload adjusters, springs, shorter spacer and thicker oil, which allowed me to lower the front by about 10mm. Front feels amazing now, but I am going to remove the airbox in favor of couple of angled up short uni filters with water socks, which should give me enough clearance for the oem 600rr shock. 

[shinyribs]

On 5/21/2020 at 5:50 PM, cemsicles said:

That's awesome info, thank you. This is exactly why I asked as I have seen a few people who had to weld after getting a crack. I am planning to measure the spaces and make sure when all said and done it remains exactly the same after everything is bolted together.

Just completely overhauled my front suspension with preload adjusters, springs, shorter spacer and thicker oil, which allowed me to lower the front by about 10mm. Front feels amazing now, but I am going to remove the airbox in favor of couple of angled up short uni filters with water socks, which should give me enough clearance for the oem 600rr shock. 

Good luck, man! Let us know how it all works out for you. 

[cemsicles]

On 5/22/2020 at 6:14 PM, shinyribs said:

Good luck, man! Let us know how it all works out for you. 

Well, seems that the 600rr shock is a little short (long?) I was wondering if preload adjustment would help to change the length a bit. None of my spanners fit the dang thing, so I might get a set from harbor freight tomorrow and see how that fairs. It seems that no matter how much I raise or lower the bike its just slightly off to put the rear bolt in.

Edited June 10, 2020 by cemsicles

[shinyribs]

20 minutes ago, cemsicles said:

Well, seems that the 600rr shock is a little short (long?) I was wondering if preload adjustment would help to change the length a bit. None of my spanners fit the dang thing, so I might get a set from harbor freight tomorrow and see how that fairs. It seems that no matter how much I raise or lower the bike its just slightly off to put the rear bolt in.

I don't remember exactly, but the length difference was pretty minor. Less than 5mm iirc. The overall length (off the bike) won't be changed by preload. The spring is plenty strong to keep the shock fully extended. 

[cemsicles]

27 minutes ago, shinyribs said:

I don't remember exactly, but the length difference was pretty minor. Less than 5mm iirc. The overall length (off the bike) won't be changed by preload. The spring is plenty strong to keep the shock fully extended. 

No, I mean I wasn't able to line up the rear of the shock with the bolt to guide it in. I am guessing its because i lifted the engine instead of putting jacks under rear sets. I am going to try to see if i can line it up better on jacks tomorrow.

On an update it seems like you had the right idea with your fabrication. Even with uni filters there's space issues. I figure people use super short cheap pod filters as I cannot imagine quality pod filter not getting in the way of a 600rr shock reservoir. My 4" angled uni filters definitely make plenty contact, but they are practically sponges so we will see... if i can line the damn bolt.  

Edited June 10, 2020 by cemsicles

[cemsicles]

 

On 5/22/2020 at 6:14 PM, shinyribs said:

Good luck, man! Let us know how it all works out for you. 

Well after many cuts, bruises and curses... i was able to grind off and smooth the sharp edges on the bottom collar of the 600rr shock and fit it to the bike. As for whatever reason it stopped me from aligning the bolt holes.

 

My settings now are 2 clicks on preload for sag, and 50/50 both damp and rebound until I figure it out. It touches the uni filters a little but hasn't been an issue after 100miles. Though I lost shocks front nut, which I realized later that I forgot to torque. I applied a little locktite which I am sure I shouldn't have to be technically correct.

I feel front is still a little loose on full throttle but thats just best I could do with just preload adjusters, heavier oil and shorter spacers. 10mm lower forks definitely feel great with oversized bars though.

Whole suspension upgrade cost me front as well as rear combined 100 bucks with everything included. Very happy with results and highly recommend to everyone who rather not spend 800 bucks on a 5 grand bike.

[firstyammerha]

Didn't someone find a filter assembly with an angled intake and filter arrangement that cleared the reservoir on this shock?  The filter was still out in the open as I recall but the fit was better than the pods we see used normally. 

[TurdFerguson]

@shinyribs

I seen your post on another forum that the weld on the shock ended up splitting? Did you end up fixing this and how is it holding up?

 

I think this is worth mentioning in case someone else (me) decides to embark on this journey...

[shinyribs]

20 hours ago, TurdFerguson said:

@shinyribs

I seen your post on another forum that the weld on the shock ended up splitting? Did you end up fixing this and how is it holding up?

 

I think this is worth mentioning in case someone else (me) decides to embark on this journey...

Hey man, yeah the first weld did split open.

I was in the process of moving when I first did this and I farmed out the welding since I didn't have access to my welders at the time. It lasted about 2,000 miles, maybe? I don't really remember. I think it lasted a few months or something. I slammed a nasty pothole and the pressure spike took it out. 

But by the time that happened I had my shop setup up again and I redid the weld myself. It's been 20,000+ miles since I welded it, and still going strong! 

[shinyribs]

Long story short, I've been playing with this rear shock to achieve better ride quality. It never was "harsh", but there was a certain sharpness that I'd feel in certain situations that I didn't like. Honda's recommendations for this shock, in it's original use, is 5w oil and 180psi nitrogen. 

I'm now running 3w oil, nitrogen at 100psi and both clickers wide open. It's cushy! If I decide to spend a day pushing hard I can tighten the rebound a couple clicks to tighten up the handling. It feels so good now that the Ohlins cartridge kit up front ( which I've always been happy with) now feels a bit firm in comparison. 

 

Just a heads up for anyone else.

[JJ_08]

@shinyribs I'm planning on replicating your shock setup and was interested in seeing how you're routing the hose.  I was wondering if you could post a couple photos of your bike showing how the shock, reservoir and hose are mounted?  I saw you're running a 25" hose - did you find that was a good length, or would you go longer or shorter if you were to do it all over?

Thanks!

 

[shinyribs]

On 12/29/2022 at 3:36 PM, JJ_08 said:

@shinyribs I'm planning on replicating your shock setup and was interested in seeing how you're routing the hose.  I was wondering if you could post a couple photos of your bike showing how the shock, reservoir and hose are mounted?  I saw you're running a 25" hose - did you find that was a good length, or would you go longer or shorter if you were to do it all over?

Thanks!

 

Hey JJ, I think the hose length was perfect. Not a great picture, but I think you can make everyone out ok. I never looked the faux frame spar cover things and took them off pretty quick, so you'll have to figure out how to mount things If you've still got those on your bike. Heat really doesn't affect reservoirs like folks think ( dirt bike reservoirs are almost always right up against their high mounted exhausts), so it can go about anywhere. Had it to do over again, I'd probably just mount it off the frame tube right above the valve cover on the left side of the bike using a block of rubber and a couple nice stainless clamps, like most aftermarket companies supply you with. 

 

You can see how it's routed running under the air box here. The hose fitting on the shock body is pointed straight out the left side and those hose just laid on the engine case. The reason I'd probably hang it off the frame on the left side of the bike is because it was pretty tight to fish the reservoir under the air box without scratching things up. I service shocks at least once a year and not having to deal with that would've been nice.  

 

Not the width of the CBR eyelets being narrower than stock. You MUST shim that out properly. The factory upper mount will not tolerate ANY amount of flexing so if you start tightening the upper shock bolts with the narrower CBR shock in place you will snap the ears off the engine case. I wouldn't wish that on anyone! 

Hope that was helpful. 

[JJ_08]

@shinyribs Thanks so much!  Super helpful!

I've got a '05 CBR600RR shock on order - hopefully arriving next week.  I'll report back once I start tearing into it!